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Doing a Graduate Dip in Education in Australia (instead of Pgce) and then returning to work in UK, disadvantage?

Discussion in 'Overseas trained teachers' started by gregorymike, Feb 24, 2011.

  1. Hi all,

    Just a little background about myself.....

    I am British and have been teaching in three different countries in Asia for the last seven years, including primary, secondary and currently university level. However, I am almost certain that by the middle to end of 2012, I want to return home to live and work in the UK.

    My question is this, If I was to do a graduate diploma in education from Australia instead of a Pgce, and then return to England upon completion of the course do you think I would have less chance of finding a decent primary school job? I've almost gotten the travel bug out of me, would just love to do one last year in Australia, to get certified. Does anybody have any experience of this? All advice is totally welcomed. Thanks a lot.
  2. Hi
    First question - what teaching qualification do you currently hold? Where did you get it?
    Unless you were qualified as a teacher in either the UK or EU then you will be considered an Overseas Trained Teacher (OTT) regardless of the qualification you have or the length of time you have been teaching. If you plan on staying teaching in the UK (longer than 4 years) you will need to get QTS (Qualified Teaching Status) and you can only get that in the UK either by doing a PGCE or through an OTTP where you already have a job in a school and they are prepared to sponsor you to get QTS.
    I was trained as a teacher in Australia and taught there for five years. I came to the UK and was paid as an unqualified teacher/instructor (supply was better rates though - good when you get it - but that's getting harder now too). So I spent a year doing my PGCE and now have QTS - I was able to get a permanent job as well to do my NQT year which is a bonus for someone who already has a few years of teaching experience (extra 10% PPA and lots of school support etc) and I was appointed above the M1 starting point.
    I have done both qualifications now and have jumped through all the hoops to be qualified and able to teach in both countries so I guess I can say I know what it's like...
    Good luck with whatever you decide.

  3. Hi tafawke,

    Thanks a lot for your reply. I really appreciate it.

    You mean that you did a grad dip in education from Australia AND the Pgce in the UK?

    I am a British male but only have a bachelor's degree in business studies and also hold TEFL certification. I have taught English as a Foreign Language (EFL) in Thailand, Japan and Korea since 2004 teaching all levels.

    If I did the graduate dip in Education (Primary) in Australia, the course runs from February-December, then I would head to the UK in January and hopefully do some supply teaching. I know that I wouldn't yet have QTS in the UK BUT the Australian Certification IS recognised in the UK and if I can find a permanent teaching job in the UK, then from what I read, it won't take me long to gain QTS.If I did 7-8 months of supply teaching then I'd hope to have a permanent job lined up for when the school semester starts in September.

    The other option, is to just head to the UK and do a Pgce, however my heart is a little set on Australia for a year.

    Any other opinions most welcome, thanks.
  4. Tafawke,

    One thing I am a little confused about. If you did the Grad Dip in Education from Australia, why did you follow that up with a Pgce? It is possible to a holder of a Grad Dip in Ed from Aus to gain QTS in the UK (from what I've read, it doesn't take that long), without having to do a Pgce.
  5. I am thinking the same and I am applying to PGCE (UK) this year and the Grad Dip in Oz. I have a place at Monash already and am applying to Edith Cowan too (cheaper)
    As I understand ityou do not need to do a PGCE after a Grad Dip in Oz. You will need to get QTS only and that cabn be done by teaching in the UK as an unqual teacher and being assessed for QTS. The TDA website states this in a section on OTTs.
    Of course you need to find a position to teach primary to be assessed and that is the tough thing. Do exp in Oz, and then International schools?
  6. Mararnril, just a quick heads up Eddy Cow doesn't have the best reputation as an institution. You might be better paying the extra cash. Monash has a pretty good rep. Something to consider.
  7. Sorry forgot to add...
    Gregorymike - you can't get a permanent job in the UK without QTS so you will only be able to do the assessment route whilst on supply contracts... and the universities usually expect you take the full year (minimum) to be able to document all the standards to gain QTS.
    And, as an OTT you can only work without QTS for four years
    Supply agencies tend to forget to mention a few of these things...
  8. Tafawke,

    Thanks a million for your great insight and advice.

    Because of you and other genuinely nice and helpful posters on here, I now realise that the Aus route is not the way to go for me as I intend to work and live long term back in the UK.

    I will now put all of my energies in to trying to secure a Pgce place for 2012.

    Thanks again.

  9. Hi Phie,
    Yes, some Australian freinds have told me Monash is a good school. But Western Australia seems a better place to get a job after. I will want to do a couple of years post qualification to get experience. It seems this might not be an option now either as WA have stopped the visa sponsorship scheme. So I may get the qual and then be unable to get a job to get the exp.
    As others have pointed out it is tough to get a job in the UK with an Australian qualification. I have had a lot of contact with Australian teachers in my present job and they were all excellent, so it seems the courses must be pretty good.
  10. The gossip from WA teachers is that getting work in Perth is nigh on impossible well at least permanent positions. I'm Western Australian, but work interstate. My mother is happier with me 3000 kms away with a permanent rather than suffering under the department as her friends are. The deparment will stuff you around for years with contracts. There is always work in the the remote a rural areas but not in along the South West Coast. Even then the department will play games with your life.
    Where you training has little bearing on which state you a eligible to work in. So long as your qualification is recgnised by other state departments and registration bodies you fine. In the past schools may have preferred teachers from universities in their own states as they would have studied that state's curriculum and system in depth. Now, with the advent of the national curriculum that will be less important. I should warn you WA has an interesting system that have many unique differences to most places. To learn it's system may not stand you in the best stead. Not that it will be a major issue if you are flexible in your ideas.
    It's lovely to hear that you have had excellent experiences of Australian Teachers. I wasn't impressed with my training. It was only a starting point in my career. What has made me a good teacher is the time in which Australian teachers have to hone their skills. I have 19 contact hours a week as a secondary teacher, that means of the 70 lessons in a fortnight at my school I teach for 56 of them. Essentually, I have a 1 2/5 of a day planning and preparation a week, just under 3 days a fortnight. When I compare this to what I got in England this is heaven. In England I think I had between 3-4 hours of ppa time a week. I'd had three years experience in Australia and that was the only thing that kept me sane. I knew how to teach and had lessons etc prepared. I have no idea how begining teachers in England cope even with their reduced timetable which I suspect is swallowed up with working towards their QTS. My point here is you learn to teach in the classroom with the kids not away at uni.

  11. That is pretty low, phie. In my old job here in the UK, I had 24 contact hrs which was pretty much maxed out. In the present one, it's 20 hours at the moment (not including tutor time, etc), but soon to go up in the present straitened circumstances. Enjoy your job over there!
  12. Thanks for the info Phie,
    After qualifying, I would be willing to work in the more remote areas in order to build my experience after qualifying. I am not worried about location too much.
    Certainly food for thought and I will have a long think before accepting any places as the course is expensive.

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