1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hi Guest, welcome to the TES Community!

    Connect with like-minded education professionals and have your say on the issues that matter to you.

    Don't forget to look at the how to guide.

    Dismiss Notice

**********!! DO NOT USE!!

Discussion in 'Teaching abroad' started by the hippo, Jan 28, 2010.

  1. yasimum

    yasimum New commenter

    This thread has yet again confirmed my opinion that as a profession we suck at walking the walk when it comes to conflict resolution. It is an emotive issue but people do have different opinions and feelings about it. Then we have people commenting on how others mustn't be in hardship postings etc, etc.
    I personally would not use a website that is making money for a paedophile but that is my choice and I certainly wouldn't slag off someone else for exercising their right to choose. Yes, he is in gaol and being punished and whatever happens to him, I'm sure he will be able to afford the best therapy money can buy to help him get over his experiences but will the children who have been exploited be able to afford the same?
    Anyway, whatever your thoughts, why do we have to get personal? It does seem to be a trend on TES though, I must say.
     
  2. Having reflected on my post overnight, I realise that it does come across as being directed at Hippo personally. I apologise for that. I really don't mean to be throwing any stones at individuals on here and Hippo always seems keen to help others. I'm absolutely sure that they are 'sound as a pound'.
    My comments are really just directed at an attitude more than a person. I really don't like paedophiles and I have had professional dealings with them in the past. I feel that teh criminal justice system does not treat their criminality in a serious way and until it is treated as strongly as the person who does the act of rape or indecent assault, it will continue to be viewed as less serious by the potential paedophile and the public.

    So, once again. Sorry Hippo for questioning your personal morals on this issue.
     
  3. Mainwaring

    Mainwaring Lead commenter

    Would you care to explain exactly why not? Is it perhaps because politicians never seek office for reasons of self-aggrandizement?
     
  4. the hippo

    the hippo Lead commenter Community helper

    Dear happynotlucky,
    The Hippopotamus is an animal with a thick skin, so of course your apologies are fully accepted. I would like to apologize too, as my tone was perhaps a bit flippant.
    Although I am a slow-witted pachyderm, I can understand and sympathize with teachers who feel that ********** is somehow tainted or polluted because its creator is a convicted paedophile. Every teacher should, of course, be on the lookout for things that may in some way be harmful to the children in our care. However, I am not at all convinced that ********** does have a bad effect on anyone and everyone who uses it!
    Yes, the man who created ********** may still be receiving some income from his work. This, I think, is the heart of the matter. I am sure many teachers will not want give any kind of financial help to someone who has done something that strikes at the heart of what teaching should be all about, namely the welfare and safety of the children who are in our care. This then leads to the question, "Is he more likely to re-offend if he continues to receive money from **********? Or is he less likely to commit this crime again, if he has some financial stability when he comes out of prison?" Well, I do not have a crystal ball and simply do not know the answer to that one.
    Having said all that, some of us are teaching in schools where the resources and the materials that are available for us and for our pupils are pretty limited, to put it mildly. I, for one, simply cannot bring myself to criticize or condemn anyone who wanted to use **********, given that it is a fantastic resource and one that is instantly avaliable over the Internet. Many of us have probably had the experience of arriving in an international school at the beginning of the academic year, finding that the teaching resources are few and far between and then being told, "The school order goes off in March and, if it does not get stuck in Customs, what you want might be here this time next year."
    Lastly, one small question. Do teachers think that this wretched man created ********** <u>because</u> he was a paedophile? Or <u>in spite</u> of it? If it was the latter, rather than the former, then perhaps there is a glimmer of hope and maybe teachers can use ********** with a clear conscience. If, however, it was the former, then maybe his crimes are even worse and perhaps they deserve something much more severe than a few months in jail.
     
  5. the evil tokoloshe

    the evil tokoloshe New commenter

    So in 65 years time or so, will using ********** be OK? I think using slave labour to produce gas to kill their own families and themselves in the process is more than just having questionable ethics. I would expect that a more obvious solution to this problem would be to let advertisers know the situation regarding the website's creator and they are highly likely to pull their sponsorship this scuttling his evil plan to make money out of free resources.
     
  6. As long as our convicted paedophile doesn't receive a single penny from it, vicariously or otherwise, then yes.
    Hippo. Glad you have thick skin! Paedophilia isn't a financially motivated crime, at least not at the 'customer' end compared to the 'distributer' end. You can see just what a broad finacial spectrum Paedophiles cover based on published cases. If ********** thrives or dives, he'll still have the same inclinations unless by some miracle the Sex Offenders Treatment Programme works. Keeping him off the internet might remove temptation for him. Maybe he wanted to be in a business that allowed him heavy access? I don't know.
    I would hope that some enterprising so and so could set up a similar site that would solve this problem.


     
  7. juakali

    juakali New commenter

    A complete clone could be done, prices vary
    http://www.scriptlance.com/projects/1264698977.shtml
    Any takers?
     

  8. For those of you who do not work in the UK you might be interested to know (as I understand it from the many many postings on the primary forum) that the owner of the site in question not only gains financially from the site whilst in prison but that the site contains a downloadable tool bar which in certain conditions could allow access to your computer and can encourage children (if they have access to the site) to be involved in posting/communicating with the site. Many LEAs in the UK have now blocked the site completely at their schools because of the many issues involved.
    I appreciate that you may have limited access to resources but there are other sites out there too. This person has been convicted before, has changed his name and used to be a teacher..(I believe)
     
  9. If you need to access the resources at school, google search what you need eg ********** french resources then when the results come up click on 'cached' you can then right click on the little box that would be the link and download to your hard drive. You are accessing the site via googles cache so not feeeding the adverts and giving money etc to the site.
     
  10. I will not be using the site due to to its connections with pedophilia; when I look at my ********** resources, even though they are amazing, they are a reminder of this horrible revelation. Imagine if the children concerned were members of your class - how would you feel about using his site then? There are other sites out there. Here are some I use, top quality free resources:
    Mrs Pancake: http://mrspancake.com/
    Kizclub: http://kizclub.com/
    and I've some free resources to download on my own blog:
    Learning Parade: http://learningparade.typepad.co.uk/learning_parade/ (follow "share" in nav. bar)
    Hope this is of help!
     
  11. miketribe

    miketribe Established commenter

    I use lots of websites in my classes. Should I, perhaps, be asking for a criminal records check on the administrators of each site I log into?
     
  12. yasimum

    yasimum New commenter

    C'mon Mike. Of course that is not practical or possible but if you know what the owner of the site has been up to then it is a different matter. You then have the background knowledge with which to make a choice.
     
  13. the hippo

    the hippo Lead commenter Community helper

    Let's just suppose, for a moment, that Shakespeare had been a paedophile. Does that mean that schools all over the world should stop reading his plays?
    Or imagine, if you will, that Doctor Mengele really had discovered skin grafting. Would you say then say that no surgeon should ever use skin grafting to help a burns victim because of its associations with Mengele?
    We all know that the Nazis were keen on the music of Wagner. Does this mean that ever Wagner CD should be destroyed and every Wagner concert should be cancelled?
    Werner Von Braun helped to develop the V2 rocket, used by the Nazis to kill thousands on Londoners. Does that mean that the American government should close down NASA?
     
  14. yasimum

    yasimum New commenter

    Shakespeare is long dead and we are talking here about someone who is profitting from a site whilst he is apparently in gaol on child sex offences. As I said before you have to make your own decisions but it just isn't comparing apples with apples when you are talking about people who are dead and buried and aren't profitting from the sale or use of their wares.
    As far as Wagner is concerned, of course one would be stupid to not listen to his music, if you are a Wagner fan, because he was a favourite of the Nazi party officers. What does concern me about Wagner is his own published works damning the Jews. something he published at first under a nome de plume and then had another go at it in his own name. I don't have to deal with that moral dilemma as I find his music oppressive and harsh.
    I can certainly understand people's qualms about using a site that is run by a paedophile though and it is an issue that would make most of us stop and think.
    SOme people will feel strongly enough about it to make it their 'line in the sand' and others won't. Quoting long gone miscreants wouldn't make me feel differently whatever I had decided as it really is a moot point.
     
  15. the hippo

    the hippo Lead commenter Community helper

    Yasimum has argued that it is okay to use something that was created by someone who was evil, provided that they are long dead and in the past. I would argue that it is okay to use the work of a pervert as he is thousands of kilometres away and it is most unlikely that he will ever be allowed to come to the United Arab Emirates, where I am currently teaching. In any case, I honestly believe that there is nothing on the ********** website itself that is any way morally corrupting or harmful. It's just full of really useful educational resources that teachers all round the world can use in their classrooms to enhance their children's education. For example, why should my students in the UAE miss out because someone in the UK did something horrible and disgusting? If teachers in the UK do not want to use **********, well, that is their choice, but isn't this forum for teachers who are teaching in international schools? (Here in the Emirates, I suspect that the authorities have ways of dealing with sex offenders that are rather more effective.)
    Maybe Yasimum has never had the misfortune to be working in a school where there are few resources. For many teachers, ********** is a goldmine of great educational material.
    Perhaps the original idea for ********** came from this criminal, but my guess is that lots of other people have worked hard to make this website one of the most popular ones on the web. Is their work to be trashed as well?
    Yes, this wretched man is receiving some money from advertising revenue. That, in itself, is not a crime, surely? This might actually be a good thing. If he gets some cash through his own honest work, isn't it more likely that he might stop his perversion and try to lead a decent, useful life when he leaves prison? (Maybe if more people had bought Adolf Hitler's paintings, he would not have started World War 2!)
    Yes, this man has done some horrible things and no doubt he fully deserves to be punished, but banning ********** or getting the website closed down was not part of the sentence handed down by the judge at the end of his trial. Punishing someone twice for the same offence is unjust, whatever their crime. The right people to determine this man's punishment were the judge and jury, not people writing on an Internet forum. If teachers who use this forum are unhappy about the Criminal Justice system in the UK and they believe that this man should be locked up for the rest of his life or receive some punishment that is even more severe, then I suggest that they should write to "The Times" or maybe to their MP.
    There is nothing wrong with ********** itself, so why shouldn't teachers use it? Why should the innocent be punished with the guilty?
     
  16. yasimum

    yasimum New commenter

    As i said,itmay be a 'line in the sand' choice or not as the case may be. Hippo, how can you assume I have never worked in a school that has few resources? My early career was spent in the most deprived inner city schools in my town. We didn't have a lot of resources but WE were resourceful.
    This is surely not the only website on the WWW that produces teaching resources.
    I'm sure the children who suffered at the hands of this person and countless others like him would agree with you. You are making out that teachers are innocent victims who will crumble if hey can't use that particular web site. If that is the case then I think we should look carefully at who we are training to become teachers and how we train them.

     
  17. yasimum

    yasimum New commenter

    Oh, by the way, people on here are not talking about getting the site closed down. Others can still use it. He is not getting punished twice, people are exercising their right to scruinise his accountability and vote with their feet just as any other business where one loses faith in the vendor. It is called democracy.
     
  18. SMT dude

    SMT dude New commenter

    Deepest February, with miserable winter unrelenting. Swine flu had gone away, for now, but swinish tempers embittered the staff rooms and corridors of the Anglo-American International School of Ruritania. The authorities, seasoned managers of the baser human passions, turned their thoughts to &lsquo;panem et circenses&rsquo;.
    <font face="Times New Roman"> </font> Bread, it seemed, was out of the question, for the economy was as bleak as the weather and the treasury was bare.
    <font size="3"> </font> But a public spectacle &ndash; an auto da f&eacute;, with the agonies of a scapegoat to warm the hearts of the godly&hellip;
    <font face="Times New Roman"> </font> It came as a blessing when Mrs Venge and Miss Spite knocked at the principal&rsquo;s door with the news that Hester Prynne, a pretty young Year Two teacher, had failed to obey the inquisitors&rsquo; command. Rather than destroy the ********** resources which had once helped her survive most of a two-year contract in Kuwait, she had concealed them at the back of her Literacy cupboard &ndash; but not well enough to escape the Right Reverend Jedediah Stickybeake, chair of the Health, Safety, Public Morality, Dietary Discipline and Spiritual Hygiene committee.
    <font size="3"> </font> Hester&rsquo;s confession was rapid, complete, damning. The last Friday before half term was appointed as her day of penance. On an afternoon of bitter north wind with flurries of stinging sleet, the president of the staff association, Pastor Goodman Whistleblowe, led Miss Prynne, barefoot and sackcloth-gowned, into the playground at the end of a coarse rope. The entire school had gathered round the bonfire in the centre &ndash; the children solemn and tremulous, the adults exultant.
    <font size="3"> </font> As Supreme Minister, it fell to me to preside. Commanding silence with a beetling of my saturnine brow, I tugged the cowl from Hester&rsquo;s newly shaven head. After allowing the onlookers to enjoy her abject trembling figure for a few moments, I turned to them and demanded a scarlet lipstick. A dozen bling-bedizened hands rummaged in purses and bags, but Miss Spite was the first to proffer me a gleaming tube. Her long blood-red fingernails clicked as she placed it in my hand, and I glimpsed her fine bosom heaving with holy zeal, her moist lips parted in anticipation, her rich brown eyes aglow with the spectacle to come.
    <font size="3"> </font> Extinguishing the searing spark of lust that Satan had sent, I turned to my victim, and applied the lipstick trenchantly to her forehead, painting a livid scarlet letter &lsquo;S&rsquo;, to symbolise Hester&rsquo;s Shame, her Sin, her **********. Tears streaked her ashen face, and just as Satan had tempted me briefly a moment earlier, so, as I admired my handiwork, another, gentler voice seemed to whisper something about stone-throwing and sinners.
    <font size="3"> </font> This too, I repressed. Handing the wretched young woman a box of matches, I bade her light the pyre, a stack of firewood interleaved with ********** wall posters and laminated reading cards from the same pernicious source. The librarian had contributed a few dozen Victorian novels for which there was no place on the IB Diploma programme. Dickens, Hardy, George Eliot and Hawthorne were to feed the flames for the common weal.
    <font size="3"> </font> A small group of Year Seven boys joined Miss Prynne, condemned to share her humiliation for having defiled their homework diaries with John Terry stickers. Between them, they kindled a crackling blaze, and for a minute or two, the school warmed its collective conscience watching a spear of flame compete with the dying winter sun. As the fire waned, Mrs Venge conducted the last rites, sprinkling Hester&rsquo;s shiny blonde curls among the embers.
    <font size="3"> </font> Then, a &lsquo;nunc dimittis&rsquo; from me, and the school dispersed, with many a gleeful backward glance at Hester Prynne, prostrate with anguish on the chill tarmac. Home for half term, to gorge for a week on the savage cleansing joy of self-righteous wrath, the matchless pleasure of unanimous condemnation.
    <font face="Times New Roman"> </font>
    <font size="3"> </font> As they parted, a freezing squall blew black flakes of ash from the bonfire into Mrs Venge&rsquo;s iron-grey hair. Shuddering slightly, she quickened her steps towards the car park.
    <font size="3"> </font><font size="3"> </font><font size="3"> </font>
     
  19. yasimum

    yasimum New commenter

    You are scaring me dude!
     
  20. ....Crikey!!...... Me too!! [​IMG]
     

Share This Page