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David Lammy..get a life.

Discussion in 'Personal' started by delmamerchant, Jul 3, 2017.

  1. delmamerchant

    delmamerchant Established commenter

    I think his comments re not having a white, upper middle class, male judge are racist, sexist, classist and ignorant. Is he assuming then, that every judge whom may be a woman or ethnic minority would have come from a working class family whom lived in a tower block or some for of local authority housing? I understand that there are issues relating to being able to connect with people, but surely as a judge you should not have to have a connection with every type of case that you preside over? Or am I misunderstanding his point?
     
    hhhh, Oscillatingass, lanokia and 4 others like this.
  2. calamansi

    calamansi Lead commenter

    I think I agree, in principle. However, I can understand the misgivings of the residents.
     
    coffeekid and needabreak like this.
  3. Scintillant

    Scintillant Star commenter

  4. artboyusa

    artboyusa Star commenter

    How about we wait to see if he performs his role in an honest and impartial way before we judge this judge?
     
  5. Noja

    Noja Senior commenter

    One of his friends was in the tower and died. He is making it his mission to keep fighting for justice. I can understand his misgivings here, in the same way that lawyers in America will try and move trials to areas where they are more likely to get a jury which will be sympathetic (black, white, Jewish, Christian etc) He wants to make sure this is taken seriously now, rather than have a Hillsborough situation.
     
    emerald52 and slingshotsally like this.
  6. Dragonlady30

    Dragonlady30 Star commenter

    Why does everything have to be politicised?

    In the early days after the fire, the politicians from the council were mightily thin on the ground and the vacuum was filled with ordinary folks plugging the gaps of food and clothes.

    While the politicians-local and national- are sniping, grandstanding and bragging, there's still a problem, folks need homes. As artboyusa wrote, judge the man on what he does.
     
    lexus300, peter12171 and theworm123 like this.
  7. Didactylos4

    Didactylos4 Star commenter

    I believe, from his statements, that the appointed Judge has similar misgivings.
    “I’ve been asked to undertake this inquiry on the basis that it would be pretty well limited to the problems surrounding the start of the fire and its rapid development in order to make recommendations about how this sort of thing can be prevented in future ... I’m well aware the residents and the local people want a much broader investigation and I can fully understand why they would want that. Whether my inquiry is the right way in which to achieve that I’m more doubtful,”

    He has be given a limited remit and seems to doubt that this is sufficient.
    Maybe we should be talking more about what the inquiry should be about rather than who chairs it?
     
  8. Noja

    Noja Senior commenter

    And it is politicised, the minute people ask whether it was a complete accident, or if it was the result of decisions made by politicians, whether local or national. If, as it seems, there are questions to be asked about cladding, about health and safety checks, about the decision not to put in sprinklers, all of which have a much wider implication, then it is political.
     
  9. emerald52

    emerald52 Star commenter

    The poor reaction of KCBC and Theresa May politicised this atrocity. Lammy speaks for the people who have no public voice. The judge may well be a good choice technically but that is not good enough in this situation. Emma Dent Coad , their MP, says the same as Lammy.
     
  10. zizzyballoon

    zizzyballoon Star commenter

    How about he declines the role because he perceives it as too limited? That would be the most sensible thing for him to do. What is the point of waiting till further down the line? Surely it is important to widen the remit of the inquiry and then to find a judge who better fits the bill? There's no sense in having an inquiry that will be expensive and lengthy and yet won't deal with all the issues, and the outcomes of which will not satisfy people.
     
    emerald52 likes this.
  11. elledriver

    elledriver Lead commenter

    Enquiries are never satisfactory unless the conclusions are what people want to hear..
     
  12. lexus300

    lexus300 Star commenter

    If we are not careful we may end up with too many judges and not enough facts.
     
  13. ROSIEGIRL

    ROSIEGIRL Senior commenter

    The inquiry versus inquest route is a tricky one as both have their limits and advantages. And those close to the events, including David Lammy, are bound to hold strong opinions.

    No one wants another long wait for action like Hillsborough, or a judge swapping fiasco like the Child Abuse inquiry.

    And I may be a bit over sensitive, but I think the title of the thread is a bit inappropriate - he's not making a fuss about something trivial.
     
    anotherauntsally, emerald52 and InkyP like this.
  14. slingshotsally

    slingshotsally Star commenter

    It's distasteful, inappropriate.
     
    ROSIEGIRL and emerald52 like this.
  15. calamansi

    calamansi Lead commenter

    I'm still wondering about inquests. Coroners have set powers - access to paperwork, for example. Will the inquests and the public inquiry work in tandem or or what?
     
  16. Burndenpark

    Burndenpark Star commenter

    I don't really see what the problem is here. Surely the aim is to establish what went wrong, why, who bears responsibility and eliminate or at least reduce the risk of it happening again.
    Something like this needs a sniffer dog- not a lovely friendly pooch who is too busy being everyone's friend to get the job done.
     
    Oscillatingass likes this.
  17. Didactylos4

    Didactylos4 Star commenter

    That depends on the format and remit of the inquiry.
    In most cases the inquiry will take precedence and the inquests will open and be adjourned until the inquiry is completed
     
  18. Didactylos4

    Didactylos4 Star commenter

    From what I have read and seen (so far) all those areas of inquiry are fairly limited in scope
     
  19. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Ah. The great British inquiry.

    Hillsborough.
    Rotherham.
    Orgreave (Oops, there never even WAS one for Orgreave).

    So swift. So decisive. Bring people to book so quickly. Expose the negligent. Uncover the truth.

    Yes. Our inquiries are legendary for their speed and efficiency and their ability to cut through the ket-rap and get to the truth and get things done!

    :p:rolleyes:
     
    slingshotsally and ROSIEGIRL like this.
  20. Burndenpark

    Burndenpark Star commenter

    In which case it's the scope they should be objecting to- not the guy chosen to conduct it.

    How many people would refuse to see a specialist doctor on account of it being "a white, upper middle class, male" and insist on having someone more like them- even if it meant they didn't know their hubris from their humorous?
     

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