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Daily rate was non-negotiable... but so is mine!

Discussion in 'Supply teaching' started by RonnieTheRedPanda, Jul 20, 2019.

  1. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

    I recently make enquiries to a city-centre agency which a lot of local schools seem to use. The conversation was going well, I established that they don't use umbrella companies.... so far so good......then they said their daily rate is £100 and they will never pay any more. I said that I don't work for less than £120 and made it clear I don't budge from that. So I ended the conversation right there. I have made that my guiding principle while on supply and I have stuck to it.

    Then it got me thinking, I said no but they will obviously find plenty of other teachers who will accept that. If EVERY supply teacher refused to accept this low pay, then agencies would be forced to pay more. But it needs everyone to do it.
  2. Jesmond12

    Jesmond12 Star commenter

    I would love to know what they are charging schools.

    My daily rate is £130 for primary.
  3. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

    I would also love to know. I think head teachers would be shocked to find out what a supply teacher or TAs actually gets after deductions. Even £120 is what I was receiving 7 years ago when I first did supply. Yes this agency could pay more than £100, I have no doubt, but they won't. I wish the whole thing was regulated and through LEA supply pools. I also wish I could offer my services o schools as a self-employed supply teacher , but schools have told me tbey are not allowed to do that.
    agathamorse and pepper5 like this.
  4. pepper5

    pepper5 Star commenter

    Hi Ronnie

    Welcome to the forum.

    Well done for sticking uo for yourself. Schools are also culpable in the low rates - the Heads know supply teachers are exploited.

    Anyone teaching 150 children for £100 is being exploited - that is in secondary where you might be responsible for that many children.

    You woukd be better off retraining as a computer programer or surveyor.

    Even a plumber or gas engineer.
  5. Stiltskin

    Stiltskin Lead commenter

    I imagine it is more likely they don't know how to do it or do not want to take on the extra cost to them to do it. It would be nice if schools were forced to say how much they pay on average for one day's supply as it is public money they are spending.
    RonnieTheRedPanda and pepper5 like this.
  6. CarrieV

    CarrieV Lead commenter

    Oi, are we related?

    We are charged £200 for long term primary supply, a TA is currently costing us £120 a day!
  7. pepper5

    pepper5 Star commenter

    Yhe money the agency receives will not not be profit ; if the are paying PAYE the will have to pay NI contibutions.
    agathamorse likes this.
  8. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

    Thank you Pepper, I have posted a few times in the past but I seem to be a new commentator now! I have always enjoyed reading your posts and found your advice always to be kind, helpful and constructive. Heads are simply interested in paying the lowest price possible, and unfortunately nobody cares about the welfare of supply teachers. I like to campaign to improve conditions for supply teachers by raising awareness. Think how a good supply teacher who gets on with job, teaches something and keeps order is largely ignored by SLT , but as soon as there's any problem.....
    agathamorse and pepper5 like this.
  9. bonxie

    bonxie Senior commenter

    It costs the local authority £230 a day (including the relevant employer contributions to National Insurance Contributions) for primary school supply here in Scotland. Teachers don't work though agencies though so individuals get paid a bit more appropriately than in England.
  10. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

    Some NQT supplies get as little as £80 a day. And a TA 1 or 2 may get between £47 and £55. Shocking!
    agathamorse and pepper5 like this.
  11. CarrieV

    CarrieV Lead commenter

    We want to take on the TA on a permanent basis but there is an 18 week penalty period to work through first!
    agathamorse and pepper5 like this.
  12. Jesmond12

    Jesmond12 Star commenter

    That is not true. I once hired a supply teacher for a regular once a week booking. We had to do all the reference and DBS checks that an agency would normally do.

    The teacher had to be VAT registered and she submitted weekly invoices. We agree a fee of £195 which was cheaper than using an agency.

    I think that schools use agencies because of the convenience even though it might be more expensive.
  13. Jesmond12

    Jesmond12 Star commenter

    Not always the case. I cared about the quality of the teacher who was in front of the class. There were those who I always asked for and unfortunately a few that I would not want back.

    I usually greeted the supply teacher in the morning and took them to the classroom and visited them at the end of the day to thank them for coming.

    Now that I am doing supply I am seeing the role from the other side and very few schools do what I did. The schools with a poor SLT are the ones I don’t return to.
  14. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

  15. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

    I wish I could do this. Local schools have told me that some regulation or other means they are not allowed to do this - they have to go through agencies. These included schools who knew me well and even my own child's school where I was on the PTA.
    agathamorse likes this.
  16. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

    The school I am currently in recently booked a magician for a PTA event. He charged about £200 for an hour and a half. (He was very good!!) He invoiced us and we have him a cheque there and then.
    Which leads me to two points...
    1. Why can't a school just invoice a self-employed supply teacher in the same way?
    2. If I put on a clown suit, called myself the Incredible Ronnie and did a few tricks, I'd earn a great deal more than a supply teacher does!
    JohnJCazorla and agathamorse like this.
  17. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

  18. RonnieTheRedPanda

    RonnieTheRedPanda New commenter

    I wish I'd worked in your school! Yes there are head teachers who do that and who value supply teachers but unfortunately not all. Once I'm in a school, I charm them and they ask for me back. But unfortunately some heads won't get the chance to employ good teachers like me because they use the rip-off agencies that I won't work for!
  19. Rott Weiler

    Rott Weiler Star commenter Forum guide

    Because of HMRC rules about what counts as self-employment. But a school can employ you direct of daily contracts if they choose to. Not being able to employ you as self employed doesn't mean they have to use an agency, I guess it's just less hassle for them.
  20. gintera

    gintera New commenter

    Whereabouts are you? I'd expect rates in London and Frinton not to be the same.
    agathamorse likes this.

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