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Children needing the toilet during lessons

Discussion in 'Secondary' started by cally4, Sep 20, 2007.

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  1. cally4

    cally4 New commenter

    Hi

    Can I ask something as a parent? My child has just started secondary and it appears some staff refuse to allow a child to leave the class for the loo. They have 5 mins between classes and have to use that time, however if a lesson is at the top of the next block it takes 5 mins to get there and the loos are on the bottom floor! If you are late you get a detention. My daughter came home distressed as she had been desperate for the loo (It was first lesson after lunch) and was refused permission. Some staff give cards which explain why a child is out of class but this teacher never allows anyone to use the loo. She had awful tummy ache so desperate was she and ended up leaking as she ran to the loo after the lesson.She was so devastated she pleaded illness and I left work to collect her. I am absolutely livid and quite honestly feel this is practically child abuse. It is quite common to need the loo following a meal and drink an hour or so later and to refuse the loo is cruel. My child is quite a reserved child and yet she asked for the loo 3 times and each time the eacher got more and more stroppy. With this age group due to start periods as well this concern me immensely. I wonder how the member of staff would feel not being allowed to use the loo? Is this common practice in secondary? My husband and I wish to make a formal complaint as this has had a terrible effect on her second week of "big school." Will this ruin our relationship with the school?
     
  2. cally4

    cally4 New commenter

    Hi

    Can I ask something as a parent? My child has just started secondary and it appears some staff refuse to allow a child to leave the class for the loo. They have 5 mins between classes and have to use that time, however if a lesson is at the top of the next block it takes 5 mins to get there and the loos are on the bottom floor! If you are late you get a detention. My daughter came home distressed as she had been desperate for the loo (It was first lesson after lunch) and was refused permission. Some staff give cards which explain why a child is out of class but this teacher never allows anyone to use the loo. She had awful tummy ache so desperate was she and ended up leaking as she ran to the loo after the lesson.She was so devastated she pleaded illness and I left work to collect her. I am absolutely livid and quite honestly feel this is practically child abuse. It is quite common to need the loo following a meal and drink an hour or so later and to refuse the loo is cruel. My child is quite a reserved child and yet she asked for the loo 3 times and each time the eacher got more and more stroppy. With this age group due to start periods as well this concern me immensely. I wonder how the member of staff would feel not being allowed to use the loo? Is this common practice in secondary? My husband and I wish to make a formal complaint as this has had a terrible effect on her second week of "big school." Will this ruin our relationship with the school?
     
  3. Well as a teacher you will be surprised how many children ask to go to the toilet and the children have enough time to got to the toilet but if your daughter said to the teacher and said i need the toilet 3 times a lot get annoyed but as you daughter at that age i would tend to allow them as it can cause many other problems and if it was just after lunch it might be because she asked just as she got in the class i would recommend you go to the school and ask to speck to a head of the school or one them and am sure they could resolve this

    Ps also useful to ear the teacher side as many children do tell one sided story's
     
  4. Once one child wants the toilet then more or less the whole class want to go. It can become rather disruptive.

    I would speak to the school but also provide your daughter with a note that explains that she needs to go to toilet in an emergency
     
  5. I make it quite clear to all my pupils in the first week of term that I will not let them go to the toilet during lesson time (unless of course there is a medical problem in which case they should have a note in their planner). This would particularly apply to lessons straight after break or lunch when the pupil has had plenty of time to go to the loo. If you let one child go you can have half a dozen wanting to leave the lesson. Not only does this interupt the lesson but it is not unknown for pupils to arrange to meet their mates in the loos, cause damage, wander round the building setting off alarms etc. HOWEVER having said that when you get to know your pupils you soon find out which ones are ikely to be trying it on. Also if I had a pupil ask me a number of times I would let them go in that instance but make it clear to them it is a one off! As a teacher I cannot leave my class to go to the loo but I am an adult and your daughter is a year 7 trying to get to grips with the new secondary school regime. She is fortunate to have a 5 min. break between lessons that she could use to go to the loo. I think I would have a quiet word with the teacher concerned rather than make a complaint particularly if this is going to be a regular problem.
     
  6. gruoch

    gruoch Occasional commenter

    Agreed with hockeynut.

    There is no excuse for a child needing the loo straight after lunch/break.

    How would you feel if the staff swanned off to the loo whenever they felt like it?
     
  7. I would say to your daughter that she must always go to the loo at the end of lunch to try, even if she doesn't think she needs to go.

    As for your comment " wonder how the member of staff would feel not being allowed to use the loo? " well we are not allowed to leave classes unattended so this happens a lot. Often we only get a few minutes for break or lunch too so we just do our best.

    I don't think a 'complaint' or 'being livid' will help but it's your call.

    If you say to kids "Whenever you need the toilet, just pop your hand up and no problem you can go" our classes would be empty. A lot of the time kids ask to go because they're bored. In any case, as I have said in previous posts, I would have tried stalling her and then let her go eventually.

    Most schools have breaks every 2 hours - if she needs to go more than that could there be a problem?
     
  8. I agree with the above points. As teachers, we can't use the bathroom when we need to - often, we teach through the morning then have break duty with no opportunity to go until lunch time. We CAN'T go when we want as you suggested. If she's only a year 7 I can understand why this might take some getting used to - but do bear in mind the practicalities of letting every child go when they want (and many children do ask for the wrong reasons).
     
  9. In how many jobs can you go as and when you want? Not many. School should prepare children for this reality.

    OK, the above is a slightly harsh viewpoint when we are talking new Year 7 - but the principal is also backed up by the trends mentioned above - i.e. disrupting the lesson, meeting others in the loo, the 'domino' effect (one goes, they all want to).

    I only let children go if I'm sure they're not putting it on, if they have behaved in the lesson so far, and if they have not had the opportunity for an hour or more. I don't let them go after break or lunch, unless it's a girl and there may be 'female issues'!

    But kids are quick to play on this and abuse it, and it causes no end of problems if they start getting away with it when they dont need to - so you can surely see why teachers have no choice but to be strict on this issue.

    "I wonder how the member of staff would feel not being allowed to use the loo?"

    I can't - it's not a problem!
     
  10. Very correct with the one child goes the rest want but i know our school where your only allowed the toilet if they have a toilet pass and rest is with a hall pass.

    But i bet today i will have the same problem but the children don't understand why we cant just pop out to the loo
     
  11. I never used to let them go in the lesson after dinner or break(they were always too 'busy' to go during dinner!) but for the other lessons i'd usually give them a few minutes(to disrupt any potential meeting plans!) and then let them go.(one boy/girl at a time!)

    There is nothing worse than trying to concentrate on something when you need the toilet!
     
  12. I'd second most of what's been said above... and also add that it may be worth checking the school rules as this is often covered. It may well also be in the home school agreement that students are not to leave lessons.
     
  13. frustum

    frustum Lead commenter

    So often it is a judgment call as to whether the child in question really does need to go, or whether they are trying it on, or could manage to wait until the end of the lesson.
    I once referred a pupil to the school nurse as he asked so often - she agreed to get him in for a chat to check whether there was a reason, and to issue him with a card if it was genuine. He never asked again! However until that point I had been unable to work out for myself whether it was genuine need or just a wish to take a break.
     
  14. gmf

    gmf

    I've worked in schools where it was policy the NO children should leave the room during the lesson - if applied sensibly (e.g. the child with nose bleed is allowed to leave etc.) then it works well.
     
  15. One asks, they all ask, and it becomes a joke. If the kid does have a problem, then a toliet card should be issued. Kids will try it on...it's their nature...
     
  16. Always a tricky one. The last school I worked in allowed children to go if they asked once and then about 10 minutes later asked again. (Genuine ones ask again, those up for a fag often forget and disprupt the class in different ways!). This rule came about after a male colleague refused to allow a girl to leave, she had asked on a number of occasions to go. At the end of the lesson she had to stand up with a pool of blood on her chair and a blood stained skirt. Not a nice tale, but true. Teachers need to use their judgement.
     
  17. yea like as i am a PE teacher we have a strict policy of no toilet and if you ask more than once you get a punshiment exercise but i was talking to a boy today who need the loo and he just walked out of the class and i do feel for it but i let them go if they are being real and don't just want skive or get there fag break
     
  18. If they ask mor than once they get an exercise punishment! What?
    And what about the case I mentioned above? As a young girl who has maybe only just started her periods, telling a male teacher that she thinks she is 'leaking' is a bit tough.
     
  19. well our school have problem with skivers and it school poilcy and it more because they disprtite the lesson like i normal let kids go if they ask me after i spoken and not just shouted out.

    also i was told let girls out and don't let boys out but i don't and i don't belive in that
     
  20. markuss

    markuss Occasional commenter

    You can see why it's more difficult with girls, though, can't you?
     
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