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'chav' in Spanish

Discussion in 'Modern foreign languages' started by jestar, Nov 17, 2006.

  1. My question was actually a serious one because I think this is where the prejudice arises. When people arrive in another locale, no matter who they are, the resultant dissonance is where the dissatisfaction and prejudice come in. Group X don't do things OUR way (dress/talk/eat/act/believe our way). So what happens when that starts to cause problems? This happens everywhere. Some Scots believe that English incomers come in and take over. Catalans are not comfortable with some Andalusian customs IN Catalonia.
    Obviously, the best way forward is tolerance but when it is perceived that the incoming group are affecting the way of life of the original settled group, then what?
    I suppose I am questioning the extent to which multiculturalism should go. in case you see this as xenophobia, I have spent 12 years living in foreign countries, married an Oriental, speak 4 foreign languages but I also feel that the local culture should be protected from takeover.
    Also, my other point was talking about "chavs" IS denigrating another group - whether they deserve it or not!
     
  2. @stormonth I see what you mean. Yes, I agree with you: teaching our children how to offend people in other languages is probably not a good idea... me thinks.

    I also agree as regards conserving local culture, but, unfortunately. that often gives rise to intolerance.... in any culture, be it Scottish, English, Castilian or Catalan... It's a fine line to tread.
     
  3. BigFrankEM

    BigFrankEM Occasional commenter

    "I would hope that, increasingly, Spain is becoming a country in which the different nations within it are respected and, more importantly, respect each other."

    Does the use of the word "nations" mean your answer is "yes"?


     
  4. @BigFrankEM - I chose my words carefully and made myself perfectly clear. Let me know if you need any further explanation.
     
  5. BigFrankEM

    BigFrankEM Occasional commenter

    <h3 style="margin:12pt 0cm 3pt;">Post 60, final para:</h3><font size="3"> </font> &ldquo;Now the next question might well be, "Is the Kingdom of Spain" a multi-country state?

    Post 62 main part:
    <font size="3"> </font> &ldquo; I would hope that, increasingly, Spain is becoming a country in which the different nations within it are respected and, more importantly, respect each other.&rdquo;

    Post 67 part:
    <font size="3"> </font> &ldquo;Does the use of the word "nations" mean your answer is "yes"?&rdquo;

    I could/can see that you did indeed chose your words carefully.

    "I...made myself perfectly clear"

    Is that a fact or an opinion?

    If the former: no comment.

    If the latter: I beg to differ. (Personally I would not have posed the question in post 67 had the previous answer been "perfectly clear")

    Subsequent to the last post, however, your answer is now perfectly clear. Indeed. To me, at least.

    In footballing parlance, the score would go like this I reckon

    L&acute;Etat Espagnole 18 : La Catalogne 0.

    Euskal Herria? "The umpire sent that team for an early bath. Before they took the field!" She said that she had incontrovertible evidence that their mindset "just wasn&acute;t cricket"
     
  6. @BigfrankEM The original post was about "chav" in Spanish, which some of us found a) denigrating and b) that we shouldn't be really be teaching kids this sort of thing without qualifying its use.
    You insist in going off on a tangent about nations and countries aboout which, really, I couldn't care less. All I care about is the fact that some people are being referred to using pejorative terminology which might be construed as offensive.
    You seem unable to understand that.
    If the topic of nation states within countries interests you so much, why don't you start your own thread and see if anyone is interested?
     
  7. BigFrankEM

    BigFrankEM Occasional commenter

    Fair enough in terms of "the facts"


    I have indeed gone off at a tangent to some extent.Though I do not think it was I who started the hare of "countries within states" running, I have pursued it with a little vigour.

    Not so fair at all in terms of "the opinions", however. Just a little bit far-fetched, in fact. To use a neutral word.
    The first para above is shall we say a little bit on the "stranger to the truth" side of the debate.

    Proof? Look back at post #46.Which is where this poster joins in the fun. Not a single high-minded word is printed there about the denigrating nature of the language of chavs. Anything but!

    "Full blown involvement in the topic" would be my take on a first post which:-

    * rejected 2 suggested translations for chav

    * but offered the perfect translation from the locality of the posters childhood; majolillo.

    Now if the poster cares to copy and highlight the words of caution and concern about the minefield of translation which chav exemplifies, and about which I do agree, but of which I cannot see even the most cursory mention in post 46, then I will be shown publicly to be less than perceptive in my reading and, how shall I phrase it, my "ability to understand" said post.

    And as for opinions on topics "about which I couldn&acute;t care less", well although the poster is not at all interested, s/he took the trouble to venture an opinion twice, #62 & 68 on matters of such scant interest.

    Now that combination of lack of concern and of taking the trouble to post twice I do readily confess is one which I am "unable to understand"


     
  8. feel better now?
     

  9. LOL jose! And there I was impressed how you could teach and comment on TES at the same time!
     
  10. jimmegee

    jimmegee New commenter

    "Les beaufs" was definitely the term French friends from Paris used to use for shellsuit-wearing suburbanites with nasty bleached hair. And has anyone thought of "orteros" for the Spanish? When I was in Barcelona, we always used to be saying "que ortero/a" about any tackily-dressed chav espa&ntilde;ol. I love these questions!
     
  11. Sol22

    Sol22 New commenter


    <u>" Un kincorro o una kincorra" if they are just as common as a mug! but "sin antecendentes policiales"</u>

     
  12. I've used "hortero, hortera" for people with poor dress sense but never for a chav. You can be a member of the Royal family and still be hortera if you clothes don't match.

    I've never heard of kincorro/kincorra, is it a new expression? Is it used now everywhere in Spain?
     
  13. In Spain there are several words that could be the equivalent of "chav". In Seville we use the word "cani" and further south in Cadiz they say "bajuno". But if you go to Castilla using these terminology they may not know what you are talking about. The word "un chorizo" has nothing to do with a chav and we use it colloquially meaning " a thief".
     
  14. I am Spanish, and I always translate "chav" with the Spanish word "macarra".
     
  15. Right, it really depends on what region in Spain you are talking about, I&acute;ve been mainly in the south and I&acute;ve heard "cani" in Seville, "chavacano" also which means the same. This one makes me laugh cos this word actually begins with "chav!", and another one is "burraco"
    G
     
  16. Hi hola
    I think the best definition of chav is "macarra" but i have to agree it is a difficult one
     

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