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Can we talk about why there are no P/T members of SLT

Discussion in 'Career clinic' started by ssep192, Sep 27, 2017.

  1. ssep192

    ssep192 New commenter

    I am great at my job. I love my job. The kids respond well to me and staff respect me.

    I have just had a baby. I love my daughter. I want to be a role model to her like my working mum was to me. I want to see her grow up

    It seems the above two paragraphs are not compatible. I applied for part time (4 days a week) and was told the impact on other peoples work load would be too much and that the students need consistency. Fair points but in what circumstance can I therefore ever have a part time management or SLT post?

    The teaching proffession seems so archaic compared to other careers. I am cross and angry. To do my job properly I need to be at work by 7:30 and leave no earlier than 5:00pm. When do I get to see my daughter who wakes at 7:30 and goes to bed at 6:30.

    I will be leaving my job in February in order to be a 'mum'. I am devastated. How is this happening in 2017?!!!!
     
    simonbfc and blueskydreaming like this.
  2. phlogiston

    phlogiston Star commenter

    It's not just teaching.
     
  3. Fizzbobble

    Fizzbobble Occasional commenter

    There are. I worked with some. A lady who worked 0.8, didn't come in on a Wednesday. She was deputy head. Not a huge school, admittedly, but decent enough size. You just have to find somewhere that'll let you do it.
     
  4. muso2

    muso2 Established commenter Community helper

    How sad - it's their loss in my opinion. Although it's more convenient for SLT to be full time, this seems a bit short-sighted.
    It can happen - I worked in a large city secondary school where a deputy head came back part time after maternity leave. She might have even been 0.6.
     
  5. GLsghost

    GLsghost Star commenter

    You may not wish to pursue a grievance, but there is so much in your post that needs the input of a specialist lawyer or regional union official. You need to act quickly, though, as time limits are very tight.

    The bottom line is that it's is NOT acceptable practice in 2017 and the law has made provision to end such archaic beliefs for some time.

    Impossible to give very precise information because your opening post lacks detail (I don't advocate that you post in greater detail, to protect your identity). However, depending how you made your request, there may be a complaint of a refusal to allow flexible working which is capable of amounting to indirect sex discrimination. This further is relevant to the refusal to consider a part time worker as a senior member of staff.

    You are right: there are plenty of good employers who can facilitate part-time work for the most senior of managers. It is too easy for some schools to fall back on excuses that are long past their sell-by date.

    Please also to your union about this. Complaints have to be made with an Employment Tribunal (should there be no better way of resolving the matter) within 3 months minus one day of the last substantial act of discrimination. The clock is ticking and time running from the point at which your request was refused. Were you told of the right to appeal the decision? And did you?
     
  6. arianasarah866

    arianasarah866 New commenter

    My head is p/t after having a baby and other members of the SLT are the same so some schools and academies make it work which i think they should if possible!

    The hours are awful with a family though really. Some days I don't feel like I see my kids but at least I can make up for it in the holidays!
     
  7. caterpillartobutterfly

    caterpillartobutterfly Star commenter

    I cannot for the life of me see how you can go from 'my school won't let me do X' to 'the entire profession is archaic'!

    If your school cannot or will not accommodate what you need, then you need to look elsewhere or fight if you can. Please don't go down the route of tarring the entire profession because one HT in one school said no.
     
    Piranha likes this.
  8. Pomza

    Pomza Star commenter

    I know three part time DHTs and one part time AHT.
     
    sabrinakat likes this.
  9. BYusuf

    BYusuf Occasional commenter TES Careers peer advisor

    I once asked at a leadership interview to work P/T (4 days a week) due to family circumstances at the time. No one had ever asked before however my request was granted.

    As others have already stated above, there are schools who would welcome you working P/T.

    I agree that on the whole, there is a way for the teaching profession to go in terms of flexible working arrangements.

    The #MTPTproject is one organisation that you should check out as they provide advice and training opportunities for working parents who are undertaking leadership roles and / or on maternity/paternity leave.
     
    simonbfc likes this.
  10. ssep192

    ssep192 New commenter

    Caterpillarrobutterfly, of course there are exceptions. I did not mean to tarnish the whole proffession and in a forum such as this did not think it was necessary be so explicit about not doing. It goes without saying there will be exceptions, I do not think anyone needs that fact pointing out, we are all pretty intelligent.

    I am basing my opinion, not only on my request but on several of my teacher friends and colleagues from other schools. In 12 years or teaching over 3 very large high schools, not one person has had there request approved.
     
  11. TCSC47

    TCSC47 Star commenter

    Having worked almost half my career in several high level jobs out side teaching I would concur with this statement 100%. For a supposedly people centred industry, teachers are treated more like equipment than people with needs.
     
    Tinycat1234 likes this.
  12. install

    install Star commenter

    I agree with you. It is archaic in some places.

    I have two mates who agreed a job share between them and went to slt who agreed it. I have another who is high up in slt in another school and works three days a week. In both situations, they negotiated a deal with their schools.

    There is a level of unfairness in some schools though, where it is assumed that 'your time' even after working hours does not belong to you and possibly more so in dome schools if you are on the leadership scale.

    To be fair, the issue of consistency given by some schools is a point - but in reality, maybe if some places really wanted their staff and offered family friendly working hours, they might look at solutions like job sharing or otherwise.:cool:
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2017
    Tinycat1234 likes this.
  13. cornflake

    cornflake Senior commenter

    I have a PT deputy. It's not what I wanted or what the school needed - but in the end, it was better to have her 0.6 than not at all! And I didn't want to loose her completely.
     
  14. cornflake

    cornflake Senior commenter

    I can also add that she's arguably more effective 0.6 than she was when FT - possibly because she knows time is limited, but also because she helps keeps a sense of perspective on things! But luckily she also appreciates she is a Deputy - so if something urgent crops up, she has to step up regardless. And she doesn't mind email contact from colleagues who need to ask her stuff even when she is "not at work"
     
  15. Mrs Brewer

    Mrs Brewer New commenter

    I was p/t .8 curriculum leader. New head came in and said any leaders had to be f/t. When I pointed out that she was .8 she said 'it's different for me, I'm being employed on a consultant basis!!' I fought it for 10 months but had to give in eventually. Guess what, she's gone now and the policy she brought in no longer applies...
     
    simonbfc and Tinycat1234 like this.
  16. slingshotsally

    slingshotsally Star commenter

    I know of one school where the are two PT headteachers doing a job share. Unfortunately, all their staff are full time even those who returned to work after maternity leave.

    It might be due the returners not being able to afford part time. The HT's earn more according to pay scale, so Part time is manageable financially.
     
  17. GLsghost

    GLsghost Star commenter

    That'll be because it's discriminatory. That HT was fortunate not to be on the wrong end of a sex / part-time workers discrimination claim. She'd would have been if I'd had anything to do with it.
     
  18. Tinycat1234

    Tinycat1234 Established commenter

    I see the frustrations on both sides and agree that education is not necessarily the most flexible of careers for flexible working arrangements for a variety of reasons. I think most higher level SLT positions nowadays really require such a level of hours and commitment that it’s hard to do part time. I think often positions are offered part time but people are never really able to ‘clock off’. On the other hand, I know of lots of Assistant Heads that are part time.
     
  19. hhhh

    hhhh Star commenter

    There are many people (some on here) who seem to think no teacher should be part-time.
    Also why do you have to be SMT to be a role-model?
    Other issues include the fact that all teachers now work many more hours than MOST used to. Many mums were teachers as it was a nice (honestly) job that let you work from 8.45 until 3.45 and have every weekend and 99% of those long holidays to yourself...yes really. Many teachers used to be running out straight after the bell, smiling bye to their pupils and their parents as they walked home.
    And this meant many mums stayed as a well-known, well respected teacher at the local school-and often ended up teaching their pupils' children. Their own children were happy to have a nice relaxed mum too.
    But then progress happened.
     
    Flere-Imsaho likes this.
  20. Tinycat1234

    Tinycat1234 Established commenter

    Ah yes all those extra hours and looks at us shooting up the international tables as a result https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/education-38157811
     

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