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Discussion in 'Supply teaching' started by useless, Mar 5, 2011.
Has anyone tried to sign on during the holidays or when there's no work? I'd appreciate any advice.
Try a search for JSA holidays & jubilee (who's the expert on this one), this question crops up regularly.
If you are unemployed, even for a short period, are available for f/t work and actively seeking f/t work, you can make aclaim for JSA in the school holiday periods.
You can also claim during term time if you are working under 16 hours per benefit week! You don't always get JSA money if you are earning more than your JSA allowance from your p/t work but keeping the claim open means less hassle when work falls off in term time nad in the hols. Full JSA then kicks in automatically and you don't lose the first 3 days of a claim (which are called Waiting Days and are 'unpaid').
Income Based JSA is paid for those who do not have a partner who works for 24+ hrs per week and who do not have savings over £8k. It allows you to be assessed for rent , council tax relief, payments for children and for free NHS services. It may not be worth jeopardising those benefits by taking irregular p/t work.
Those who have a working partner , and/or have savings above the £8k, can claim JSA Contributory if they have paid enough NI in a few previous tax years. For claims made in 2011 they look at your NI in 2008-09 and 2009-10 tax years.
If you qualify you get the same Personal Allowance as on JSA Income Based but don't get any other add-on payments. It is also only paid for up to 26 weeks, after which they just give you an NI credit for each week that you continue to sign on.
My tip is to sign off at some point, allow at least 12 weeks to elapse (or they will link any new claim to your last one!) and then make a new claim in the next calendar year. In 2012, for instance, you may have enough NI payments from earnings in 2010-11 to give you another entitlement to 26 weeks of JSA Contributory.
For the first 13 weeks of any claim you are entitled to only have to look for your usual work at your usual rate of pay. After that you have to sign agreeing to take any work that you are capable of doing, at the national minimum wage if applicable. You cannot, however, be made to take p/t work and you cannot be made to accept anything that makes you worse off than on benefits.
When doing p/t work and when getting paid for past work during a claim period, you have to declare the hours worked and the pay (only declare the TAKE-HOME pay and deductions on the signing day on/afteryour payday. They then adjust or temporarily cease your JSA.
Someone claiming in the summer holidays and taking LA paid supply teaching in Sept 9payable at the end of oct) could keep claiming and getting full JSA until 30th October if they did no more than 15 hours 59 minutes work per benefit week in Spt/oct. A supply day often involves you in under 5hrs 20mins per day (lunch is unpaid time) so you could do 2.5 or 3 supply days and keep a JSA claim open.
Do NOT flag yourself up as a supply tyeacher when phoning to make a claim. You are an unemployed teacher who is looking for f/t, regular work.
Be wary at some of the questons they ask, which can confuse anyone not familiar with the system. On the phone they ask "Do you only want to claim NATIONAL INSURANCE CREDITS?" Say "No, I wish to be assessed for JSA as well"
Told you jubilee was the one!
Thanks for that jubilee.
Unfortunately in my case, I haven't paid enough NI contributions- no work no NI to pay to qualify as I'm married & my husband is working. I even tried to make up my payments & that all went pear-shaped on me!
NI contributions made from voluntary payments and thoe made from self-employment (take note supply teachers paid via agencies that set them up with an intermediary company as self-employed) do not lead to future JSA Contribution based benefits.
If both JSAs are out of the question, all you can claim is free NI credits towards your eventual state retirement pension.
Once you get enough work in a tax year to pay enough NI from pay, make a note that you are potentially eligible for JSA in the calendar year that follows the end of the tax year!
That's not entirely clear, is it?
If you pay enough NI in the 2010-2011 tax year (the year from 6th April 2010 to 5th April 2011), try making a claim for JSA at any time in the calendar year 2012 when you are unemployed.
Thanks for your very comprehensive advice - it's much appreciated.
After only getting 2 days work since September I finally bit the bullet and signed on last week. You can now make your claim on-line and then you get a call to arrange an interview at your local job centre. I found the on-line claim was useful because I could go in search of any info as a I went along rather than doing it on the telephone where you get asked lots of irrelevant questions or get stuck if you haven't got all the info they want to hand.
When I went for my interview the guy seemed to be very aware as to why so many supply teachers ae now being forced to sign on.
New to all this, so thanks jubilee et al You've made an awful task a lot easier.
Thanks for all the advice too - I'm seriously thinking about signing on if I can, but my only concern is as I'm actually enjoying supply teaching I don't actually want a 'proper' job so would I have to prove that I have applied for any jobs or just have a knowledge of what jobs are out there? (I can do the latter easily, but don't want to have to apply for jobs just to get JSA!) If you do have to prove you have applied for a job, how do you do it?
Does "new calendar year" mean 5 April 2011 to 5 April 2012 i.e. April to Apri? Hence make sure you stop claiming credits before this April? Hence thinh financial years...
No. New calendar year, from today's perspective, means any time in 2012.
If you make your first claim in 2011 later in this calendar year and your 26 entitlement to JSA Contributory, based on your past NI, takes you into 2012 ...you should stay on JSA until you have used up your 26 weeks (you can sign off and back on , of course, if you get work of over 16 hrs per week) and that will extend your 26 week entitlement.
You then sign off and allow the 12 week gap in claiming. When you are next unemployed and able to make a JSA claim in 2012, they look back at a new NI year (2010/11 financial year of contributions) and that might give you a new entitlement to 26 weeks of JSA.
Forgot to add that if you don't have the 12 week gap in claiming, they continue to link your claim to the one you started in the 2011 calendar year and that means they ignore the NI that you paid in the 2010/11 tax year and you have no entitlement to JSA, just to free NI credits.
Don't overthink the situation!
Are you available for f/t work? Would you take supply bookings that were offered every day?
The system doesn't care whether you are looking for various temporary posts that will equate to full-time or one permanent post.
Your jobsearch can consist, at least for the first 13 wweeks, in contacting your LA/ agency supply consultants, contacting school offering your services and contacting new supply employers. That all constitutes applying for work. Call your agency every morning and/or afternoon and that constitutes 5 / 10 instances of applying for work.
Is our supply work in schools not a 'proper job'.
If you managed to get a term of work(p/t or f/t), is that not a proper job?
Having said that, there can be an attitude at some jobcentres that supply teachers are just working for 'pin money' and are not real jobseekers. It's best to simply tell them at the outset that you are an unemployed teacher who is prepared to (and is currently) taking whatever temporary teaching you can get.
Generally speaking, the jobscentre will not have vacancies for you on their system. They tend to have supply agency details where they are just trying to get more names on their register. You can follow those up if you want but you can also tell the jobcentre that their is no guarantee of work from the 'vacancy' on their system and that you would have to cough up for the CRB clearance, amounting to about £40 that you cannot afford.
You could take the details, contact the agency and that would be applying for work. If you don't register, you simply fill in your jobsearch diary with "mega-bucks teaching agency had no specific work in a school for my specialism and wanted me to pay £x pounds to go on their register."
If you see a permanent job in your specialism, in your agreed travel to work area, you could send off for (or download) the details, submit an application form if it fits the bill. That could be evidence for you jobsearch that week. Researching the school nad completing the application form could be part of your jobsearch in the next signing period (or two). Submitting the application is further evidence.You then wait to hear. The majority of applicants are not shortlisted.
When I worked at the jobcentre, I reviewed pathetic job diaries that just listed the vacancy ref numbers for the jobs on our boards. It did not prevent them continuing to get JSA.
A colleague's 27 year old brother had never worked. Every fortnight, he sat down with several different biros and filled out a fictitious jobsearch using the local paper for vacancies and employer details. He then went to his fortnightly signing day (not at our jobcentre).
The jobcentre cannot make you take p/t work but will be happy if you do so. When fortnightly signing, declare the hours that you worked in the previous 2 weeks but do NOT guess at what your takehome pay will eventually be. DON'T declare earnings until the signing day AFTER you are paid. Some claimants make the mistake of declaring hours and putting in the gross pay they know they will eventually get. The system then thinks they have been paid, had no deductions for tax and NI and cancels their JSA money or reduces it. Wait until p/t earnings are paid, take the payslip with you for photocopying and let them show you how to complete the B7 form.
If JSA is going to be reduced or cancelled by earnings, you could simply sign off before getting the pay and then sign back on later when work dries up.
If your JSA is £65-40 per week and you have received weekly pay of over £70, they will cancel your JSA for that week as you have earned £5 more than your JSA (they disregard the first £5 of earnings as travel costs). If you didn't get paid anything one of the previous claim weeks (because no work in the preceding week) they will pay you your JSA allowance for that week, so you would have the previous earnings + one week of JSA MONEY.
Thank you for taking the time to make me feel ok about this jubilee. I'll look into this tomorrow in what is almost undoubtedly going to be a 'day off'. Oh, and BTW, I don't look at supply teaching as not being a 'proper' job, I just wondered whether the staff at the job centre would see it in the same way.
If you are signing on for JSA and are working as a supply teacher, you are required to fill in a B7 form to declare the hours you have worked or have not in many cases. This allows them to deduct any earnings from the JSA payments, also if I fill in a B7 do not put down 8 hours, because i feel that we only work around 5 1/2 hours a day.
So can anyone help with this dilemma
Worked my first day as supply last week - on my sign on day so HAD to tell the job centre. Don't know what I'll have earnt as I've got to have the CRB costs deducted - couldn't afford to pay for it when I registered! plus NI and tax of course. Got to go in later today to fill in whatever paperwork - not sure what to tell them about how much I will have earnt.
You don't yet mention your earnings as you don't yet know what your take-home pay will be ! You only mention pay at the first signing day after getting a payslip that allows you to itemise tax, NI and nett pay.
You will be given a B7 to fill in that covers your last 2 Benefit Weeks (BW) of 1st-7th March and 8-14th march .
You enter Nil hours worked for each day of the first BW (or just put a line through it) and nil for the amount received in pay in that BW.
You put 5 hours down as today's work (or however many hours you are going to be paid for) and nil hours for every other day of this last BW + nil pay received in the BW.
They then pay you your JSA as normal for the last 2 Benefit Weeks.
If you get paid for today's work next week, that take-home pay will be recorded in BW1 of your next B7 (they'll give you the form today so that you can keep it updated as you go through the next 2 weeks). BW1 on your next B7 will be for 15th -21st March and BW2 will be 22nd-28th March.
In 2 weeks' time, if you haven't done 16 hours+ in any BW (and had to sign off) they will look at the take-home pay you declared for each of the 2 BWs ... they'll disregard £5 from each week's earnings and will then compare the remainder with your JSA entitlement. If your remaindered earnings are equal to or more than the JSA, JSA payments cease temporarily. If pay is less than JSA, they pay you enough JSA to bring your earnings up to your JSAallowance.
If you have had to sign off before receiving your pay, they will pay you JSA up to the last day that you claim JSA and your pay will not have to be declared as you won't be a JSA claimant when receiving the pay.
Jubilee - really really helpful thanks! Job centre guy was actually quite helpful too and just told me to bring in the payslip once I've got it. Very frustrating though - one day supply - CRB check cost - travel costs, tax, etc = not much more than JSA. Start to see why people say they are better off on benefits than working!