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Calais Camp Razed

Discussion in 'Personal' started by Vladimir, Feb 29, 2016.

  1. Vladimir

    Vladimir Senior commenter

    Well, half of has been and 3000 people have been rehoused in purpose-built sheds. I don't get it! Why destroy the camp and not move the illegal immigrants on? The French haven't done anything apart from making the place more pleasant to live in, which, in turn validates the migrants' reasons for being there - to get to the UK at all costs. They refuse to claim asylum in France, when they should have claimed asylum in the first safe country, if they were legitimate refugees. So obviously they should not be there. The place is starting to look like a concentration camp! Now that can't be right in anyone's books! Madness!

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ate-migrants-purpose-built-accommodation.html
     
    Grassroots_Out likes this.
  2. magic surf bus

    magic surf bus Star commenter

    Given that the Daily Mail recently published aerial photos of the wrong camp in an article on migrants in Dunkirk I wouldn't put too much store on their journalistic accuracy.

    Last BBC News story I read on the subject said the occupants of 'The Jungle' (ie unregulated tented camp) were given three options:

    1. Move to the container accommodation, which was set up for the most vulnerable among them. I assume this involves some form of official registration and monitoring. I would imagine small children don't give a **** about the UK's benefit system but would probably prefer to be out of tents in February.
    2. Formally apply for asylum in France.
    3. Be relocated away from the Calais area.
     
  3. lexus300

    lexus300 Star commenter

    If our Government made it the rule that non-British born must pay into the system for a full 5 years prior to ANY benefit claims being considered. Would that deter the non-refugees?
    Those families (not single males) fleeing from Syria and similar dire places where persecution is rife and can prove their identities could/should be accommodated BTW.
     
    Grassroots_Out and Vladimir like this.
  4. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    I pity the migrants. I pity the French. I pity the Greeks.

    It's all a right mess.

    I don't blame the Greeks for waving them through. Greece has plenty of problems of its own.
    I don't blame the French. The migrants pitch up there. Nobody can force them to seek asylum in France and I don't suppose the French want them any more than the Greeks or Hungarians do.

    Most countries want to help but the numbers are now (almost literally) overwhelming. There must be a coordinated plan. A plan that works in practice. But it's such a swiftly-evolving situation.

    The French aren't doing that bad a job really. They are tolerating the migrants. They are allowing them to get help whilst trying to let business go on as usual. The French are just about managing to keep ports open and police OUR border for us from France. Yes, I know we have border control out there too. But France is a libertarian (or thinks it is) nation and cant stomach the idea of actively mistreating migrants. Consider it a benign neglect.

    Adapted containers have to be better than tents.
    It isn't madness. What's happening in Syria and Africa is madness. Europe. by and large, is trying to do its bit.
     
  5. sabrinakat

    sabrinakat Star commenter

    If someone is working, then they should get the same 'benefits' that others also working get - however, I agree that there should be a time-limit as to when a person can get benefits such as housing and other welfare benefits.

    But....(I hate starting a sentence with....but) what of a family fleeing persecution with small children - how can they find accommodation in a new country and a job immediately? Could we not give a helping hand for say...three months, so that they can establish themselves? [I know that's naïve, but we need to show some compassion....]
     
    clermontfed and InkyP like this.
  6. InkyP

    InkyP Star commenter

    clermontfed and grumpydogwoman like this.
  7. lexus300

    lexus300 Star commenter

    I said:
    "Those families (not single males) fleeing from Syria and similar dire places where persecution is rife and can prove their identities could/should be accommodated".
     
    Grassroots_Out and Vladimir like this.
  8. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    Those fleeing persecution are almost certainly qualified to be refugees. Their responsibility is to claim asylum in the first safe country they arrive in. Any country in the EU is, by definition, 'safe'. So they need to claim asylum in Greece, Italy or wherever. They then will be allocated to another country in most cases). They don;t get to demand to go to GB sweden or wherever.

    If they fail to do this they aren't refugees, but economic migrants and should be returned to their country of origin.
     
    monicabilongame likes this.
  9. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Yes, Frank. You'd think so. But having reached safer shores I expect their thoughts turn to the fact that they already speak English, they know people here and (yes) they have less chance of working illegally in some other EU countries. Maybe we should be introducing compulsory ID cards with our NI number?

    You're right, Frank. But that's not the way it is working. And we can't return them when they destroy their papers.
     
  10. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    People from Syria aren't, I suggest, likely to know those already in the UK, and are just as likely to speak French. Anyway English, of course, is widely spoken in other EU countries (esp. Scandinavia).

    Anyone who is suspected of destroying their papers should be treated as illegals, and returned to where we think they come from. They are acting illegally - we don't need more criminals here.
     
    Vladimir likes this.
  11. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Many of the Syrians who have made the journey are those with means and it's not UNlikely that they have connections here.

    I'm proficient in French but, if I were cast out from these shores (or cast myself out), I'd certainly opt for an English-speaking nation (not Nordic) or Germany. Although I'd pitch up first in France I'm sure I'd try to make it to Germany (my German is better than my French). There'd be no telling me that I was now safe and I'd be fine in France. No. Germany for me.
     
  12. FrankWolley

    FrankWolley Star commenter


    But the point is that international law doesn't give them that right. I'd love to live in - say - Australia. But I can't (too old, not rich enough etc.) That's just the way it is. Tough. If I were a refugee from civil war I'd like to think I'd be grateful for any safe country that would take me in.
     
    Vladimir likes this.
  13. magic surf bus

    magic surf bus Star commenter

    The other day I was sifting through a pile of old photo negatives I bought at a flea market in Belgium. Among them were 15 photos of a troop ship arriving in a port in the late 1940s, then departing with its decks lined with civilians. Out of curiosity I managed to find out about the ship online. It was the SS Ernie Pyle, ordered by President Truman to pick up displaced persons and concentration camp survivors from Europe to speed up the process of getting them to America. The port was probably Antwerp.

    I've offered copies of the images to the Holocaust Museum in New York and they've accepted - obviously a bit of social history.

    It reminded me that a couple of generations ago there were vast numbers of refugees moving around Europe in the wake of WW2, everyday people displaced from one country to another who still managed to settle, adapt, and create the Europe we know today. As an island we got off lightly, and sometimes we fail to appreciate that. Probably explains why the attitude to refugees in Europe has been generally more welcoming - they've been there before.

    By the way, guess who was complaining about the influx of German Jews fleeing Hitler in 1938? The good old Daily Mail.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    Yes, you'd think. But they know Greece doesn't want them/can't cope. Why would they stay in Greece? The Greeks are doing their best NOT to encourage them. Taking ages to process them etc etc. Just shoving them on a train to be someone else's problem.

    Which is what we want to do. Make them NOT our problem. But they're here. They didn't want to be.

    Actually the train idea is a good one. Let's have a train that just circles all 28 members of the EU. OK, not us. But we can pay towards it. The migrants live on the train. They maintain the track and stop at various freight yards and work on locomotives. Oh, and lorry convoys. They live in lorries but stop periodically to build service stations. They then stay at the service stations before moving on to the next assignment.

    This way every country hosts them. Like the EU Presidency (or whatever role is rotated).

    And the ferries! They staff the ferries! They have no papers so they live at sea.

    Looks like I have solved this. You can pop my MBE in the post. Thanks.
     
  15. Vladimir

    Vladimir Senior commenter

    Trojan horse mentality. The luvvies have been barking up that tree for a while now. Once we let migrants in, we'll never get them out again. We can't even deport hardened criminals due to EU ruling. Look:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...Britain-break-EU-law-deport-home-country.html

    Moreover, once we are seen to letting people in, more will come in far greter numbers.

    And we are helping them. Inam sure we are paying for some of that new accommodation.

    When the idea of compassion is raised in relation to migrants, I have to ask myself how much compassion they showed to, for example, the likes of Jude Law and his party when they visited. Not much by all accounts!

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-Hollywood-star-left-jungle-camp-Calais.html

    I doubt he was there out of anything other than a chance to get his face in the media, after all, how many is he going to sponsor to live with him in his party mansion? Same with Emma and Benedict.
     
    emporium65 and Grassroots_Out like this.
  16. Vladimir

    Vladimir Senior commenter

    It would, but it won't because it's untenable. It's the sort of dirty trick Cameron would try and use. Without benefits, migrants wouikd have to (a) get a job, which isnt easy thes days or (b) turn to crime out of desperation. It ouikd end up being cheaper and easier just to pay the benefits and come up with the freebies. Besides, you'd never get it past the EU.
     
    Grassroots_Out likes this.
  17. Vladimir

    Vladimir Senior commenter

    And it's nothing to do with the handouts? Really? What if Spain suddenly starts giving what the UK gives, and the UK stopped giving completely. Would they still choose he UK over Spain for linguistic reasons? You know they woukdn't. And it doesn't matter anyway because immigrants are notorious for forming their own cultural and linguistic enclaves where they need know no English or local language whatsoever.
     
  18. Vladimir

    Vladimir Senior commenter

    Why don't rich Middle-Easstern countries take some migrants in? They haven't taken in a single one and won't let them in!
     
    Grassroots_Out likes this.
  19. lexus300

    lexus300 Star commenter

    We may not be in the EU for much longer:)
     
  20. lexus300

    lexus300 Star commenter

    That is the question our suburban liberalista's will not or cannot contemplate.
     

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