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Be honest...how many hours a week do you actually work?

Discussion in 'Primary' started by WB, Jan 21, 2011.

  1. Milgod

    Milgod Established commenter

    What a shame that you feel the need to have a dig at those that don't need to work 60 hours a week. Just because you feel the need to work that long doesn't mean everyone else has to. Strangely enough, you can find some pretty excellent teachers that work fewer hours than that.
     
  2. A shame? My shame or your shame?
     
  3. Milgod

    Milgod Established commenter

    A shame for you that you feel 60 hours a week is needed to do an excellent job.
     
  4. gchand

    gchand New commenter

    If you love your subject and can get the best out of the kids and can show progress and achievement then you work as long or as little as you want. If you aren't as confident then you should be burning the midnight oil (we've all been through it) and striving to improve OR be looking for another profession. It's a no-brainer really. Lets weed out those that give the rest of us a bad name. Take a lesson out of the kids books - its about attitude and the willingness to learn.
    Secondary maths teacher - Birmingham




    -
     
  5. Sorry to be patronising, *****, but I can't even be bothered to type the reply your post doesn't merit.
     
  6. Milgod

    Milgod Established commenter

    You were already being patronising by assuming you can't be doing a good job if you don't put in about 60 hours a week.

    You then couldn't be bothered to reply that you actually did reply, with a witty insult thrown in to boot. Genius. Did it take you time to plan your response? Maybe you could have been getting on with some planning instead.
     
  7. I agree. None of these have reflected on how their pupils are doing. Maybe the 30 hour a week people all work in green, leafy burbs. WB makes it sound shameful to work for your money!
     
  8. I could suggest that anyone who uses the word 'stupid' - in this context

    is NOT a teacher - or is part time - or does nOT work very hard or..

    Anyway: Michael Gove - doing a great job so far well done..( make the students work) - not the teachers..
     
  9. I think it has to be an individual thing based on workload, efficiency and experience.
    I am an experienced teacher in Upper KS2 in an Inner London Academy.
    I am outstanding- always get outstanding in monitoring, obs and drop ins. I have excellent value-added and my kids and parents love my class.
    However I work quite short hours compared to my colleagues.
    I work 8am until 4.30pm every eve except Tues and Fridays when I stay until 5.30pm. I dont work weekends.
    I come in and while laptop is booting up I get my tea made and water bottle filled. Then quick check of emails, look at my lesson planner for day (filled in night before as my last task of day).
    Then I crack on with my To Do list- I always have one of these.
    Kids are in school 8.40-3.35pm.
    I work through break and do 30min at lunch (taking 20 to go to canteen and get my dinner).
    As soon as kids gone I work solidly. As I do during PPA time,.
    I mark all my books every week (at least one in depth mark) including a long writing task levelled in literacy. I also teach year 6 literacy 3 times a week as cover relief as I was under timetable and level their books weekly as we do writing tasks. So thats 55 books levelled a week in literacy.
    Working hrs in teaching can fill as much as you allow. I work solidly and efficiently and when lessons are planned, resources made, books done I go,. When I am in I give 100%.
    I do think though I worked in excess of 70hrs when I was an NQT looking back but now I have built a bank of resources- all of these I have filed on my computer by year group, subject, topic and ability. Those long hrs back then mean I can work less now.
    I think we shouldnt get bogged down in how much we work but more in how efficiently we work. Smarter not harder etc

     
  10. <font size="3">Anyone who works less than 45 hours is not doing a good job, WB is probably one of these ***.</font><font size="3">if all teachers stopped pretending that they do everything asked, which is impossible. The government may then address the issue of reasonable planning and prep time. And stopped pressurising the profession to destruction.</font><font size="3" face="Calibri"></font>
     
  11. Absolute rubbish.

    If you are an NQT and have lots of planning to do fair enough. Otherwise it is due to a lack of efficiency that people spend horrendous hours of time a week doing work. If you wish to spend your lunch and breaks drivelling on about naughty kids then you will waste time but there is no feasible reason why people should work anymore than the average office job, albeit we start much earlier.
    There are NCT times to get marking done and the summer term to plan for the year ahead.
    I have been in the profession 6 years, been promoted every year and do no work at home on an average week/weekend. I think a lot of people just like to martyr themselves ' oh woe is me' because they are not very effective time managers.
    There may be twice a year I have to do work at home.
    Consequently, I feel it is one of the best jobs going with the holidays and so on.
    Good classroom management and time mangement makes teaching an excellent profession to be in.

     
  12. roddywoomble

    roddywoomble New commenter

    After tax/NI/student loan repayments, I earn &pound;5.30 per working hour.
     
  13. This has the potential of making me really cross, but surely it depends on so many factors. Those who are in the "I work very few hours" category, that's great for you, but for those of us who aren't, it would be really helpful if we knew what stage/subject/position you were in before you tarred all of us who work long hours as workshy/lazy/lacking efficiency.

    Here is my position:
    Seconday HOD (essay subject, YES this does make a difference). I teach 41 hours a fortnight. I have 5 KS3 classes, 4 KS4, and 1 KS5. I force myself to stop for half an hour ALMOST every lunchtime, and take 20 minutes at break about 3 times a week.
    I am at school (and working apart from those hours above):
    Monday 7am - 4.30 (Department meeting)
    Tuesday 7am - 4.30 (Revision session)
    Wednesday 7am - 4 (Middle Leaders meeting once or twice a term pushes it to at least 5)
    Thursday 7am - 4.30 (Coursework Catch up)
    Friday 7am - 3.30 (GET OUT!!!)
    7am - 8.30am is generally spent finishing off any resources I need for the day, photocopying, replying to e-mails, setting cover for teachers off sick, filling in forms (for example, achievement evening nominations, intervention for critical students, and a whole load of other stuff expected of us) I work on my own in my classroom, and do no "nattering" or tea making. OCCASIONALLY (maybe once a week if I'm lucky) I finish this early and spend 5 or 10 minutes in the staffroom.
    When I get home, without fail I do 2 hours of planning. I am in my third year of teaching, and, although I have a bank of lessons building up, even if I CAN use them, they need to be altered in order to suit the class (in my mind, this is the bare minimum to ensure I am actually a good teacher), and I am always improving on last year's work. With recent changes in curriculum and KS4 and 5 syllabus, more often than not I have to start all over again.
    I am to mark the books of KS3 classes fortnightly, and KS4 weekly. I often fail at this. Regardless, I would say that on average I am marking books for 5 hours a week. KS5 marking (a class of 15 writing one essay a week) takes about 2 hours at least. Most of this marking is done at the weekend.
    so:
    7-4.30 - 30 mins lunch = 9hrs a day
    45 hours a week - break times = 44 hours a week.
    2 hours planning 4 nights a week - 8 hours
    5 hours book marking
    2 hours essay marking
    59 hours for an average week.
    On top of this - each class has a levelled assessment once a term, which will take about an hour per class to mark.
    We have 6 parents evenings throughout the year
    half terms are taken up with long term planning, although i leave the long hols to myself.
    reports - about 2 hours per class, once a year.
    tracking, about 20 minutes per class, 3 times a year.
    I already feel like I am managing my time as efficiently as possible, and that I am doing the bare minimum to be a GOOD (not outstanding) teacher.


     
  14. teach321

    teach321 New commenter

    The SMT requirements (amount of planning required to be submitted/number of assessments required)/stage of teaching/year group/number of children in class all make a huge difference to the number of hours spent planning/marking/preparing.
    Teaching my year 1 class with 23 children, covering topics I have covered before (i.e little time required for planning - though with obvious adjustments for the needs of the class) with little requirement for handing in planning and once termly writing assessment (of relatively little writing) resulted in very few out of school hours and very few marking hours (lots of practical activities, or marking done whilst the children were there). Compared to teaching year 5 in a different school, teaching a new year group with all new topics with vague objectives and no resources, with planning needing to be detailed and handed in regularly. Lots of assessment required/ APP for every child in the class (who all write a lot) with work referenced etc etc.
    I believe my quality of teaching has remained the same, however my work hours have doubled.
     
  15. Here, here getrichquick. I choose to work as long as I need to to support students as best I can. I give extra help at lunchtime and after school because I care about how the hard working ones do. I work about 47 hours a week and between 2 - 6 at weekends but enjoy the long holidays hugely. For those of you who don't put the same sort of hours in - bully for you!
     
  16. <font size="2">I have no problem with many of my colleagues in subjects like PE and Music willing giving up evenings and weekends for the benefit of the children in their care. I do not consider them idiots or mugs and admire their dedication. On the other hand I do not descry others who want to leave school at school so that they can enjoy home at home. The concept of work/life balance has been raised a number of times and that I think is important. We teach far more than our subject and a profession of monks and nuns (I mean no disrespect to any religions who have such individuals in their ranks - I speak metaphorically) may not be the best role models for our rising generation. The irony that many of us could potentially be spending far more time with other people's children than our own seems lost here. Perhaps many of you are having to spend so many hours because we have a society that lionises long hours spent at work and in devotion to our vocation and patronises or denigrates those who prioritise time with their own families and relish taking on many of the roles that appear to have devolved to teachers over the years. </font><font size="2">Teacher ego has always been a big problem in the profession. Since education is based on comparisons to the norm and we are successful products of that process there is a logical tendency to incorporate a comparative if not competitive view into many aspects of our lives. It does make you feel a bit better though when you can look down on someone whom you perceive as less able then yourself: I do understand the temptation. However, until we stand in the shoes of others we are not in position to judge and there will always be others &ldquo;better&rdquo; than us. Perhaps rather than sniping at each other we need to recognise that we all do an important job but in the end it is a job and should not be our entire lives or who we are. To take pride in what we do is vital but to be prideful and judgmental is unhelpful and corrosive and may explain why some of our colleagues leave as soon as the bell goes or sneer at the hours worked by those who consider themselves more dedicated (worthy?).</font>
     
  17. I always under exaggerated, thinking it was 50 hours then after sitting down with my husband, who was feeling like a single parent, a planning widower, we realised I was working @ 60. My school was in ISP and LA inspectors dropped by & observed on a whim - including the day after parents eve! I went on supply. The BEST decision I ever made. I now LOVE teaching, i look at the kids as people, not statistics or gaps in learning.
    Its great to be human again.
     
  18. well said Munchkinballerina.
    my hours are my business and not WB's. I used to work a lot less when I first started out as I didn't work in a school which pushed, nor did I have a HOY who set a good example (I definitely did more work per week than she did). BUT I am a much better teacher now, get better results and hopefully make every child feel that what they have produced has been valued.
    Does that make me a mug, stupid or plain inefficient?? If you, WB, want to add to the teacher-bashing, hate authority, only looking for a route to the least amount of work for most amount of money disrespectful society we seem to live in, then by all means - go for it. But do not expect us dilligent teachers to fall into your trap of sounding as if we are moaning about the amount of work we do. I love my job (usually), do it to the best of my ability AT ALL TIMES (not just when it's Ofsted) and do not waste time whinging about it.
     
  19. I'm a secondary music teacher so it varied hugely from week to week...

    The last two weeks have been intense, 12 hour days with a year 12 music technology pupils staying behind each night to get their controlled conditions coursework recorded in the studio, and so 60+ hours for the last two weeks running. Does this make me not very good? I thought it made me conscientious... sorry!

    Usually I get in at 7.30 and work till 5, taking lunch some days and not on others (depending on lunchtime rehearsals etc.)

    We teach therefore we have to be flexible. It comes with the job. If you don't like it get out, but don't call those of us who work damn hard to get good results and prove ourselves 'stupid' (or whatever it is you said.)

    I care for my students' progression and would rather see them do well for themselves than achieving straight A's, but often the two go hand in hand. And you don't get results without putting in the hours. This is just common sense. And some of us are still finding out feet and have to put in the hours to make sure we are providing as best we can for the students in our care.
     
  20. *varies and I did put paragraphs in that last post but my Mac chose to ignore the instruction.

    I forgot to add that it isn't always 12 hour days of course. Parents evenings, concert and show days, whole staff meeting days and CPD training days tend to be long and hard, but we do get 13 weeks off and this does make up for the long hours I put in. I find I need the holidays to recover and don't enjoy them as much as I hope to when I am settled into my career.
     

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