1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hi Guest, welcome to the TES Community!

    Connect with like-minded professionals and have your say on the issues that matter to you.

    Don't forget to look at the how to guide.

    Dismiss Notice
  3. The Teacher Q&A will be closing soon.

    If you have any information that you would like to keep or refer to in the future please can you copy and paste the information to a format suitable for you to save or take screen shots of the questions and responses you are interested in.

    Don’t forget you can still use the rest of the forums on theTes Community to post questions and get the advice, help and support you require from your peers for all your teaching needs.

    Dismiss Notice

AWR query re pay and pensions

Discussion in 'Supply teaching' started by magic surf bus, Nov 22, 2011.

  1. magic surf bus

    magic surf bus Star commenter

    I have been fortunate enough to bag a 0.6 sickness cover that may go for more than 12 weeks, and I'm currently on Agency flat rate. In week 13 the AWRs apply and I should be paid to scale. The school is not an Academy. Can anyone clarify where I stand with the following?

    Is AWR parity limited to level of daily pay only, or should I be able to make TP contributions again?

    If permanent school staff are paid via the LEA payroll system, should I be?

    If the agency starts 'encouraging' the use of an umbrella company for pay, where do I stand re the AWR? Will it still apply? Definitive answers only here please, not speculation.

  2. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    The employer will remain as the agency so you won't get the scale-pay via the LA.
    As the agency are the employer, you won't have access to the Teachers' pension Scheme.
    You won't get sick pay either.
    It's just the pay that changes. I don't know how they'll work out the pay. My daily supply rate with the LA is annual salary for my paypoint divided by 195 (number of days that a teacher is in school). That means that I get pro-rata holiday pay up-front in my daily rate.
    However, some LAs pay differently. They divide the annual salary by 1265 Directed Time hours and then only pay for the contact hours in the contract. That eliminates paying a pro-rata amount for PPA, meetings, parents' evenings, report writing and marking etc.
    It occurs to me that a private agency, unaware of the LA formulae for calculating to-scale pay (or anxious to lessen the impact on their payroll!) might take the annual salary and divide it by 52 weeks and then work out a daily rate .
    Assume sn officisl Teachers' pay point of £21k per year:
    Full LA Daily rate (divided by 195) would be £107;
    LA Daily rate (dividing by 1265 and multiplying by 5 contact hours) would be £83;
    Annual salary divided by 52 weeks and then further divided by 5 for daily pay would be £81.
    The last two may be less than the non-teacher scale agency rate!
    If confronted with the last two calculations, make waves (via Union if necessary). Working long-term on the second calculation option should involve getting the hourly pay multiplied by 6.5 hours per day, not 5, as 6.5 is the average daily Directed time commitment for all teachers.
    Option 3 should be resisted at all costs.
  3. magic surf bus

    magic surf bus Star commenter

    Thanks for the info. The school used to pay me a proper daily scale rate based on 1/195 of a year but via the agency's payroll, then they dropped it to flat rate, which in my case is about 30% below scale. I hope they'll just revert to their old payment system, but it means I can rule out TP contributions this time. It's slightly complicated by my now working on a sessional timesheet (5 sessions a day) rather than an hourly one, but as the school has a 5 lesson day that seems to be working for now.

    Daft thing is I have a payroll number with the same LEA that all their permanent staff are paid by, but maybe the additional pension and NI commitments prevent me joining them.
  4. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    Have you always worked at that school via the agency?
    The school are still paying more than the rate paid to you so employing you direct and forking out for employer NI should not be na issue. The employer pension contribution would add to their costs, of course, but without knowing what they pay the agency it's impossible to tell if they'd be sepnding more if employing you direct.
    What does your agency contract say about the time that needs to elapse last being employed by them at a school and being taken on directly by the school?
    I had hoped that LA supply agencies would re-form once the AWR came in but they now have even fewer schools under their 'umbrella', what with Academies and Free schools taking more than their fair share of funds previously allocated to the LAs.
  5. After 12 week qualifying period you are entitled to 195th of your annual salary as it would be on scale per day. All occupational schemes are not included such as sick pay, pension and you are not entitled to redundancy etc.
    In simple terms you get equity with pay and holidays (other things also but not relevant to working in schools)
    To answer your question cliveceltic if you are receiving work via an agency to work in schools, this is called tripartite relationship and as such means you are included in the scope of the legislation and have to be paid to scale after reaching 12 weeks. The fact that you are working as a limited company does not change this, they are stalling because they will have pinned all their hopes on this back door which is now not supported by the DfE.
  6. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    The legislation only applies after 12 weeks of being sent by an agency to the same workplace/school, so many agencies will, I'm sure, start swapping teachers and schools around before the 12 week qualifier.
    Anyone with an LA payroll number can approach schools direct and be paid the proper rate (+ pension) if the school list them as casual staff.
  7. This is interesting as the agency said the job is til the summer providing school like me. School have just got me a proper name badge and are sending me on safeguarding training as its 12 yrs since I did any. I'm not hassling the agency as its been 3 weeks so far but by Xmas I will have clocked up 4-6 weeks depending on what school are needing me for in the last 2 weeks of term as I do PPA cover.
  8. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    Keep a tally of the weeks that you are in school. try to ensure that you get some work (even just a day) in the weeks before Xmas or it will create a break in continuous service. The holiday weeks don't create a break, by the way. If you achieve 6 weeks by the Xmas holidays, you'll be in a position to get scale pay from mid- February if employed in every school week after Xmas.
  9. I was told by my agency that it does NOT have to be 12 weeks in one school but 12 weeks for the agency. Somewhere I have that in writing.
  10. Bobsnephew

    Bobsnephew New commenter

    No, it certainly isn't 12 weeks for the agency. The AWR identify three parties: the worker, the agency, and the hirer. The identity of the first two is, I hope, pretty obvious to all. The 12 week threshold pertains to the relationship between the hirer and the worker, and could be fulfilled through more than one agency.
    There is some ambiguity as to the identity of the hirer, acknowledged in the Department for Education's own advice sheet on the matter (downloadable from http://www.education.gov.uk/schools/careers/traininganddevelopment/a0077106/supply-teachers): "In community
    schools, voluntary controlled schools, community special schools and maintained
    nursery schools, the “hirer” is either the local authority or the school’s
    governing body. It is a matter of fact to be determined in each case and
    depends on to whom the worker is supplied and who supervises and directs that
    person’s work."

    I live near a county boundary: one (like most LAs, I believe) has determined that the school is the hirer, the other accepts that the LA is the hirer (massively to the benefit of the supply teacher). Most LAs recognise the benefit to their schools of making the school the hirer.

    Assume 12 weeks with a school, check with the LA if there is any reason to suspect that they might be willing to consider themselves the hirer.
  11. Do holidays count towards the12 weeks, for instance October and Christmas when we are still working at the school but obviously not getting holiday pay?
  12. Jubilee, I have sent you a message.
  13. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    School holiday periods do not count towrads the 12 weeks needed to trigger AWR as you are not bein g hired in those weeks. However, the school holiday periods do not count as a gap in service either, so if you worked before a school break with a school and work after the break too, with total employed weeks reaching 12, any work in the 13th week+ will be at the proper teacher rate.
    If you are not employed in the last week before the holiday or not employed in the first week back, that is a break in the tally and you are back to square one in building up your 12 weeks witht he same hirer.
    The 12 weeks can be one day per week (or one session per week) right up to full-time, with any combination of hours in different consecutive weeks when the hirer is open for business.
  14. Thanks for yor help Jubilee.

    For anyone else interested, this is the information from NASUWT. Hope the link works!


Share This Page