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Aspect 4 Rythmn and Rhyme

Discussion in 'Early Years' started by JO9832, Feb 28, 2011.

  1. JO9832

    JO9832 New commenter

    Hi
    We are just starting aspect 4 in the Nursery and its the one I dread the most ! Just wondering if anyone had approached things differently or had specific books they like to use . I have found in the past the children find joining in with repetative texts ok but continuing a rhyming string or playing rhymingo bingo really difficult. I have recently moved to a new school and have 9 different languages spoken in the Nursery and most children are still at the naming objects stage never mind rhyming having said that some have begun to genertae lists of words beginning with the same sound and noticing for example that Monday begins with M just like Maria and Megan etc
    Any responses would be most welcome

    Jo x
     
  2. We struggle with this too. I build in opportunities for children to be exposed to rhyme, rhthym and alliteration by planning activities (from letters and sounds),choosing rhyming stories and singing songs and rhymes daily but very few of the children demonstrate their understanding readily. Some are now beginning to find rhymes when we do Silly Soup and to notice alliteration especially when the sound is at the onset of their name. I was chatting to last year's Nursery teacher about this (my first year in Nursery)and she says that regular exposure to and experience of rhyme, rhthym and alliteration is the way to go and that it does pay dividends eventually.
    Hope that makes you feel better even if it's it's not much help!
     
  3. Far too much is made of 'rhythm and rhyme' and 'alliteration' in my opinion.
    These are language play activities and you could try to see them as 'fun' things to do rather than essentials.
    By all means, draw attention to words which rhyme and which start with the same sounds - but these are not pre-requisites to learning to read or for starting a systematic, phonics programme later on.
    It seems to me that you have all sorts of language priorities - like learning to speak, knowing the meaning of every day words, saying them clearly.
    Try not to be overly concerned about the children's ability to discern these things, which does not prevent you from 'using' these things in your literature work and singing, chanting etc.
    There is a difference between experiencing something and being exposed to it - compared to expecting the children to become experts in those things.
     
  4. inky

    inky Lead commenter

    Not true, I know. But don't be a slave to rhyming books. Make up your own ryhmes when doing up zips or whatever. Rhyme is fun.
    Alliteration for three-year-olds is an abomination.[​IMG]
     
  5. inky

    inky Lead commenter

    Though they love initial sound I-Spy.
     
  6. JO9832

    JO9832 New commenter

    Hi
    thanks for all the responses and yes we are expected to teach l and s and submit the data. I have decided to just go with the flow and enjoy it . Just wondering do other NT actually follow Phase 1 as it is or dip in and out of it ? I actually like lots of the activities but some i am less keen on !
    Jo [​IMG]
     
  7. inky

    inky Lead commenter

    Is Letters and Sounds compulsory? If it isn't, how can you be told to submit the data on it?
     
  8. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    No it isn't compulsory
     
  9. JO9832

    JO9832 New commenter

    It comes on an excel spreadsheet from LA and we are expected to send it in . In fact i dont know anyone who has not 'dared' not to send data In In addition we have to 'score' (1or 0) the children on entry , mid term and on exit against dm 30-50 months this then is converted into a colour Red Amber Green or white (red not meeting age related expectation , amber just below age related , white meeting and green exceeding) . Its mad you have to be so careful with the scoring as it can come back to haunt you !!!
    I hate it but at the end of the day I love the 8.45 until 315 part of the job as thats with the children and thats what I went into this job for
     
  10. something has gone jolly wrong here. A data collection tail is wagging a teaching dog. ANy nursery nurse will give the dog a decent bone and see then if its bite isn't worth its bark. We have nursery rhymes, we have action songs, we have finger plays, we have circle games, we have rhyming games, we hav songs to tidy up, we have repetitive refrains in stories, wha have games with names, we have cumulative traditional stories, we have rhyming books small and big, we have musical games on music from known songs, we can change words or whole songs to match circumstances at any given routine or occasion on any day, we have an infinite variety of ways of playing with language to stimulate the three and four year old.. There is no need to DO aspect 4, it should be part of the fabric of the nursery. Was always, needs to be now and will be as long as there are three -eight year olds. Thats what the nursery age child drinks as if it were mother's milk. Greeting time, circle time, story time, snack time, tidy up time, goodbye time should be a finely woven mix of all these elements. They were before the EYFS came along and unfortunately and inintendedly made us believe we hadn't got it right, and didn't know what we were doing. The idea of knowledge and content objectives that can be taught, assessed and retained by children of this age is unecessary and doesn't work. You would never find a mother at home saying 'well next week we will do aspect 4 of language skills'. So why should a nursery be any different. IF HOWEVER you are not inclduing this in your daily work you do have a PROBLEM as somewhere something has been missed from your training. IF you are lucky enough to have a NNEB with you try to build her skills and knowledge into the daily weave of oracy. As for the excel web sheet, just fill it in at the mid-point for everything - enough to get the majority out of the relegation zone. FOr it has absolutely nothing to do with the effectiveness of your teaching or planning - as evidenced by the fact that it aspect 4 is treated as a discreet time-limited 'unit of work'. It comes from an analytical, sequential view of planning that seems to have lost sight not only of the whole child but the whole nursery teacher.
     
  11. inky

    inky Lead commenter

    Yes.

     
  12. Yes.
    Those measurement expectations are ludicrous and it is sad that nursery people are complying at all.
    I would refuse.
    On what grounds are they demanding that measuring? What gives those people the authority?
     
  13. So sad all this paper pushing and evidence producing. Yes rhthm and rhyme is part of everyday life in our nursery but I am "doing" rythm and rhyme at the moment.Actually the children are really enjoying it especially Hairy Mcclary from Donaldsons Dairy books. Our children find alliteration most difficult. We are expected to track childrens progress with letters and sounds but not submit them. Hopefully soon it will be realised that such ludicrous amounts of data is a waste of time for everyone! good luck
     
  14. inky

    inky Lead commenter

    I can only ask again: why the fetish with alliteration?
    I discovered it long before I was told what it was called. In my case, I discovered it through the titles of the stories in the comic I read every week from 5 - 11!
     
  15. I do hope all the sensible replies you've had have put your mind at rest about the most effective way to teach your children.
    I agree that rhythm, rhyme and alliteration are just around us all the time and children begin to hear, feel, see this when they are ready. Our job is to provide the opportunities for them to do it whenever that readiness is there with them in school.
    As a teacher of Reception, I do think that Nursery children really need to concentrate on Phase 1 of "Letters and Sounds", so they are ready to start Phase 2 with us, with oral blending and segmenting being far more important skills than letter recognition at that stage.
    I share the horror that others have expressed that you are expected to submit data, to be beaten with later, on Nursery aged children. Data collection gone stark raving mad. As a school who piloted "Letters and Sounds" (actually a pretty good document, unusually!!) I have had to submit data for YR, then YR/Y1 and then YR/Y1/Y2, three times a year for six years. It's a real pain in the proverbial. I tried not sending it in to the consultant in the Autumn Term and got hassled during Christmas concert week for it. Note, this does not include Nursery.
    I would like to say that the impact on children's reading and writing in Reception of this way of teaching has been huge, so I hope this isn't one of the things this government intend to review and chuck out.

     
  16. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    Didn't the nursery previously provide language rich experiences?
     
  17. I don't doubt that at all and Phase 1 L+S supports this really well.
    My worry with the children I receive is that they've been rushed through Phase 1 and are not secure in some of the aspects which it supports, as I said, particularly oral blending and segmenting.
    Actually, now I think of it, it's about time I went back to Nursery as FS Manager to observe/monitor the ways in which Phase 1 is provided for. My Nursery teacher will be thrilled, I'm sure!!
    Thanks for the ***!
     
  18. I had no idea that would be an asterisked word! What I said meant 'to poke with a finger'!!
    What's rude about that?
     
  19. Msz

    Msz Established commenter

    Odd the words TES doesn't like
    I would argue that is nursery is providing for language development with rich experiences then Phase 1 is already covered naturally without all the artificialness of separate Aspects. Aural language isn't split up it is a complete package
     
  20. I agree with MZS. This is really a load of platitides you are saying - sorry and with the geatest respect, it is actually little to do with you, you are probably earnest, sincere and hard-working and believe the stuff that has been fed to you. There was life before letters and sounds, nurseries knew this very well, some reception classes didn't. There is no need at all for your nursery to be 'observed to see what 'phase 1 is being provided for'- Load of old top-down, managment tosh. Don't you know what to look for in a language rich nursery? Without it being flashed up with bells and dancing girls and the whole circus of letters and sounds? Let them get on with showing you ways to make your reception class more like the nursery rather than the other way around. Go with humility, go wtih an open mind, go wtih some degree of cynicism about the supposed authoroty behind the newest initiatives and I am sure the nursery will see you as an ally and be thrilled to see you. Go wth the attitude that you have here and yes the nursery will be thrilled to see you... GO.

    PS What is this obsession you have with oral-blending and segmenting in nursery- unless you are talking about the cookery table and dividing oranges up for snack I would suggest it is langauge that has no place in the nursery or reception. Children all over the world grow just fine without it, but not without cookery and snack and conversation. Teachers teach just fine in nursery withour ever considering that they have to DO it. There is a long accumulated tradition of games, stories, songs, word and sound plays, finger-plays and ways to entertain young children that used to be be the province of the nursery nurse and the experienced nursery teacher. Then - with repsect- along came Foundation stage managers- perhaps from having taught older year groups, and hey a change of water is in order ,lets heave it all out- including the baby, lets scrub up the empty bathtub, pick the baby off the ground, dress it nicely and call it a learning journey. Only trouble is the baby was quite happy splashing around as it was.
     

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