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Are you in favour of primary LGBT lessons for young children?

Discussion in 'Education news' started by TES_Rosaline, Apr 11, 2019.

  1. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Lead commenter

    utterly terrifying. Once kids start on medication ie puberty blockers there’s no way back. F*** mermaids and their CEO who vivisected her own child.
  2. averagedan

    averagedan Occasional commenter

    Yeah - the Mermaids CEO should be prosecuted for child abuse without a shadow of a doubt. Taking your child out of the country to pay for a procedure not legally available in this one because your child is too young and hasn't had their diagnosis verified by an independent psychiatrist is crazy. Waiting until someone is old enough to fully understand the consequences of their decision is essential.
    LunaBlue123 likes this.
  3. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Lead commenter

    Please delete
  4. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Star commenter

  5. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Star commenter

    Why do you think that having taken puberty blockers that there is no way back?
  6. dunnocks

    dunnocks Star commenter

    They are hugely controversial, and have had a pretty devastating impact on some individuals, including transwomen who have taken puberty blockers as children, then been unable to transition as adults because they are not adult enough physiologically, and never will be.
  7. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Star commenter

    In a way I agree with you here, I am devastated I was never offered them.

    Links to evidence please.
  8. vannie

    vannie Star commenter

    Bone thinning, compromised fertility and unknown effects on brain development.
    Vince_Ulam likes this.
  9. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Star commenter

    No links then.

    However should I need to point out that all medical intervention is a compromise there is no magic pill that cures you but at the same time has no effect on your physiology.

    You are trying to balance the detrimental effects of the actions against the benefits.

    Knowing the detrimental effects I would have taken them like a shot as the beneficial effects far outweighed the detriments, for me.
  10. vannie

    vannie Star commenter

    That is your decision as an adult. Children do not make that kind of informed choice.
    peter12171 and dunnocks like this.
  11. ridleyrumpus

    ridleyrumpus Star commenter

    Please do not speak for me.

    I was perfectly aware of the consequences and options of what was then available when I was going through puberty. Nor should you assume that I was not capable of making informed decisions at that age.
  12. vannie

    vannie Star commenter

    I was not speaking for you. I made the assumption that you were speaking as an adult. The point is that children cannot legally make that choice. Apologies if I hurt your feelings. That was not my intention.
  13. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Lead commenter

    meaning that if their use was discontinued after prolonged use through adolescence the human body would not then be able to reform or grow into the form it would have had, had they not been used.

    But this is not the point I was making. According to this testimony, no decision is ever made to stop their use once started:
    vannie likes this.
  14. alex_teccy

    alex_teccy Lead commenter

    Not my discussion, I know, but we do as adults assume that cannot make informed decisions, in fact our the way in which we raise our children as a species is predicated on the idea that children make bad decisions. Much of the discourse around this crisis revolves around the bad decisions adolescents make, influenced by trends, fashion, internet, reductionist social constructivism concepts, legal enforcement of equalities doctrine and virtue- signaling parents, teachers.
    vannie and Vince_Ulam like this.
  15. dunnocks

    dunnocks Star commenter

    There are online links you can find for yourself quite easily.

    From my own experiences, I know of two people who have suffered badly.

    one is a female colleague who was put on puberty blockers because of reaching puberty too early. She has never been well since. She is now in her 20s, and has high blood pressure, gout, nose bleeds, etc, and is at a high risk of a heart attack or stroke. She was recently told these are all side effects from the time she spent on puberty blockers as a child.

    The other is a transwoman, who wanted to transition, but can't have their body remoulded into a female body shape, because there is not enough body to work with. They are basically stuck in an elongated child's body for ever, and cannot be either a male or a female shape.
    vannie likes this.
  16. averagedan

    averagedan Occasional commenter

    That's a common theme in this thread amongst certain people, I've asked for evidence several times and received none. Make statements, generalise, take a few outliers to represent the whole community and then use data which cannot be verified such as personal experiences which are full of confirmation bias.

    Don't make the mistake I did.....
  17. dunnocks

    dunnocks Star commenter

    firstly, for balance, I do need to say most trnspeaople I have spoken to have not expressed regret to me about their transition.

    However, I know people have have massive regrets, and there are points raised in this video that are the same as points I have come across in real life.

    one is the feeling of being on a train you can't get off. Trans ideology can be like a cult you are afraid to leave. I know several transwomen who are absolutely desperate to be able to get out and attempt to reverse what they have done to themselves, but are afraid to, and in any case are aware that it is irreversible anyway, even though the car crash that is now their bodies might be possible to improve in some way.

    people get swept along into this, in many ways it is can be similar to radicalisation, or joining a cult, people find a group, they are made to feel they belong, they are persuaded to go along with it, they are led to feel that transitioning will solve all their problems....

    I have worked for a suicide prevention group, and , much as transideologists flag up the rate of suicide among youngsters having to delay transitioning, the rate of suicide AFTER transitioning is far higher, as is hinted in the video.

    Again, for balance, I need to say, that most of the transwomen I have met personally have not expressed to me any regret about transitioning, but given the catastrophic consequences for many who do, there is no way we should be promoting this as an option to our children in schools.
    alex_teccy and vannie like this.
  18. vannie

    vannie Star commenter

    Seriously? This information is easily found.
  19. Vince_Ulam

    Vince_Ulam Star commenter

    Anyone who believes that puberty-blocking & cross-sex hormone treatments are without a significant range of complications are deluding themselves, assuming they have any idea of how the human body develops over time. Most recently research has shown that transgender people receiving hormone treatments are at hugely elevated risks of heart attacks & strokes:

    "Occurrence of Acute Cardiovascular Events in Transgender Individuals Receiving Hormone Therapy." Circulation, 139(11), pp. 1461–1462

    Do puberty blocking hormones & cross-sex hormones disrupt brain development? No-brainer, of course they do. With the onset of puberty the brain undergoes significant changes in structure & neurotransmitter levels and the brain does not cease development until around twenty-five years of age. Blocking these changes at their root is effectively retarding children's growth into adult cognition & affect, and given that many children referred to gender identity clinics are already disproportionately SEN then this is disastrous for their life prospects. We see early evidence for this in the disproportionate numbers of transgender people accessing HIV care.
  20. Pottypaintpot

    Pottypaintpot New commenter

    If it’s links you want, mumsnet feminist chat boards have them all.

    This is a good one with a number of scientific studies.

    It’s also worth looking at the detransitioned threads. One on the pique resistance project I think.

    Times article - calls to end transgender 'experiment' on children

    Also an important article came out today in the TES by a transwoman, Debbie Hayton. Re safeguarding. I don’t subscribe to the TES so need to buy a copy.

    Debbie Hayton in the TES

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