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Are we just getting worse?

Discussion in 'Personal' started by CraigCarterSmith, May 15, 2017.

?

Are we getting Nastier?

  1. Yes

    26 vote(s)
    74.3%
  2. No

    9 vote(s)
    25.7%
  1. CraigCarterSmith

    CraigCarterSmith Established commenter

    Maybe it's just me, but is society just getting nastier?

    i mean everywhere, in schools, in public life, the basic lack of manners,

    lack of accountability in almost everything

    the rise of Instant gratification

    has our opinion of "right" and "wrong" taken over the common morality of "right" and "wrong"

    a shift in focus away from education and information

    is there a way back?

    Deep yes, but i'm curious if anyone else feels the same
     
    kibosh likes this.
  2. bonkers 704

    bonkers 704 Lead commenter

    Far less crime now than 30 years ago. We are much less violent, as a society - probably because there is no lead in petrol. There is a terrible inner city knife crime problem though.
     
  3. monicabilongame

    monicabilongame Star commenter

    Yes, I do feel the same. It's been getting worse ever since it became politically ok to defame the poorer, unemployed, disabled, immigrants etc. etc. Ever since it became ok to charge ridiculous rents beyond people's ability to pay. Since it became fine to make people work on zero-hours contracts for a pittance, with no sick or holiday entitlement. You can see where I'm going with this can't you.

    It's been going that way at least since the days of Thatcher and her 'there is no society' but it's got far worse since the advent of May and Trump, and their messages that it's ok to be racist and hateful.

    The lack of accountability and demand of instant gratification? That's been a longer growth period, but it hasn't been helped by governmental and the media progressive lack of respect for people in professions that once drew a lot of respect - like teachers, fire-fighters, police, doctors, nurses etc. The ones we cannot do without. The general public (that is the general public who cannot be bothered to educate themselves properly) take their lead from the popular press and believe what they read in it.

    There is a way back but it will either be a long haul or take a war or other event that shocks society into seeing what it has become, and it will also need a change of government/governance.
     
  4. Nanook_rubs_it

    Nanook_rubs_it Star commenter

    Not sure if things are generally getting nastier, only that the targets of choice change. I'm not too sure if opinions were ever required to be validated by facts for the majority; the plural of anecdote is not data.

    I believe the 'anti-expert cult' now rampant always existed in the shopkeeper mentality of those of limited self awareness, who thought that, because they could scrape a living from selling fruit & veg, or follow the processes of the bank that employed them, that professions such as education, medicine, or engineering, were being inefficiently run and that, as 'businessmen', they could do a lot better.

    Another US import to thank Thatcher* for.

    *who should have known better as a scientist, but obviously couldn't shake of her corner shop roots
     
  5. theworm123

    theworm123 Lead commenter

    I blame the downfall of populism on the spread of nationalism in recent years, the type that brought about Trump and Brexit. If I hear 'no surrender' one more time ...
     
  6. Postduif

    Postduif Occasional commenter

    I don't think it was necessarily the corner shop roots so much as the particularly joyless brand of Methodism espoused by her father [similar to the one I was brought up in]. Its basic premises were that anything you enjoyed doing was a sin, that you were not put on this earth to enjoy yourself, and there was nothing to laugh at - at all, ever, anywhere.
     
  7. Mr_Ed

    Mr_Ed Established commenter

    Can you give one example where Theresa May has sent out the message either directly, or indirectly, that it's ok to be racist? And don't say reaffirming the net migration target of tens of thousands, not hundreds of thousands. Wanting to get immigration to a sustainable level is sensible, it is not racist.
     
    MissSimps91, lexus300 and Pomz like this.
  8. oldsomeman

    oldsomeman Star commenter

    How come we blame all the ills of a society on a political party,Do people not have a responsibility to respect the law.Who teaches our young folk to be law abiding,who tells them to carry knives and use them,are schools frightening because teachers fail to provide a safe and secure place to work and study, Is TV exploitation of crime and violence not got a responsibility or the reporting only of nasty crimes, Does gangster music have effects and make sections of young folk behave and act in certain ways.Do drivers have road rage because of politics.or drive dangerously because the are fueled up on drink or drugs.
    Its crazy to blame politics per see.although frustration might have a part and yes we do have some problems but i do wonder if the situation is any worse than say it was when i was young man many eons ago..our judicial system doesn't seem to punish crimes maybe.you get minimal sentences for say murder with a car..5 years But a race crime can get you in deeper water,You ban dangerous drivers who wreck your car ve to repay for damages.....the messages are not clear when judges dont punish or authority is frightened to.
    We haven't got to the vast numbers of folks who do live in a peaceful manner and are 'responsible' citizens.Who work to make a fair society and a better one.Thats not down to politicians but to the generous spirit of people who work tirelessly to make our country good and as safe as they can to live in
     
    MissSimps91, lexus300, wanet and 3 others like this.
  9. scienceteachasghost

    scienceteachasghost Lead commenter

    Maybe it's just me, but is society just getting nastier?

    Yes and no. Arguably communities are more ripped apart than ever with Tory cuts. But we celebrate equality for all regardless of sexuality, race, gender and age in a way we certainly didn't several decades ago.

    i mean everywhere, in schools, in public life, the basic lack of manners,

    I actually believe on average kids are better behaved on average than in my generation. Part of this is that teachers are forced to get better behaviour out of kids as expectations are far higher than 20 years ago.
    Public life - The rot started with Thatcher. Despite what the Tories said about the 70s, and yes I know rats feasted on uncollected bin bags etc, the 70s was far more equal than today. Thatcher installed a 'Im alright Jack' culture which has never really gone away.
    :Lack of manners - yes and no! I am amazed that nearly everyone will say thankyou (and rightly so) to a bus driver at the end of their journey. However, Millennials and Generation Z seem to have 'abbreviated' please and thankyou out of conversation at times.

    lack of accountability in almost everything

    the rise of Instant gratification

    has our opinion of "right" and "wrong" taken over the common morality of "right" and "wrong"

    a shift in focus away from education and information

    is there a way back?

    Deep yes, but i'm curious if anyone else feels the same
     
    slingshotsally, Pomz and Lara mfl 05 like this.
  10. scienceteachasghost

    scienceteachasghost Lead commenter

    I did respond on the rest but the damn editor timed me out :(
     
    Lara mfl 05 likes this.
  11. scienceteachasghost

    scienceteachasghost Lead commenter

    Basically, I think we are MORE accountable than before, yes, there is more instant gratification, right and wrong has always had an absolute and less absolute strand and always will, there is MORE information now than ever with the zillibytes of data exchanged on iPhones, although the quality of information has declined.
    The biggest challenge is getting the system (gamed towards the elite and rich) to be fairer for all and the planet.
     
    Lara mfl 05 likes this.
  12. magic surf bus

    magic surf bus Star commenter

    I find the sight of so many people fixated on mobile phone screens or ear-plugged into their own private soundtrack in public places depressing. It's become like a form of collective security blanket to prevent them from having to engage with or consider the unfamiliar things in their surroundings.

    I think we need to look further back in time to ask if our society is nastier. Would I want to walk through the centre of London in the 17th, 18th or 19th centuries? No.
     
  13. schoolsout4summer

    schoolsout4summer Star commenter

    "Far less crime"? The huge reduction in the numbers of police officers, combined with mountains of paperwork and the downgrading of crimes has resulted in a seeming reduction in crime.
    It is just an illusion - smoke and mirrors, as they say.
     
  14. Calpurnia99

    Calpurnia99 Star commenter

    On the one hand, I think many people have become, through education, more tolerant and certainly less overtly and casually racist and sexist than when I was a child.
    But having said that, I think scum, and you know perfectly well the sort of the people I mean, have become much scummier.
     
  15. Orkrider2

    Orkrider2 Star commenter

    The Crime survey for England and Wales also seems to show a reduction in crimes.
    https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopula...gdec2016#what-is-happening-to-trends-in-crime
    crime survey.png
     
  16. JosieWhitehead

    JosieWhitehead Star commenter

    I think that we mainly here of the rotten ones, but there are more good, kind people in the world than any of these - and this starts with you and me. However, this doesn't mean that I've not met the other sort, and at an early age because I was bullied at 6 years of age and caned at 7. This was when I first realized that the world is also inhabited by awful people, both the young and the older. However, concentrate more on the nice ones - they're worth your concentration.
     
  17. Orkrider2

    Orkrider2 Star commenter

    I agree with the part about society being more tolerant than when I was a child.

    In general though, I feel it's difficult for me to judge about how much worse or better it's become. It's easy for me to think it's much worse, but part of me wonders if that's just that I've got more aware of things in the last few years since having children, getting older and seeing more stuff happen.
    For example, I'm more fearful of crime and stuff like that than I was 10 years ago, but I'm also now terrified of flying, where 10 years ago it didn't bother me at all. So is it genuinely that air travel is more risky now, or is it just that I have lived longer and seen more plane crashes than I had 10 years ago, and so it feels more dangerous?
     
    JosieWhitehead likes this.
  18. delmamerchant

    delmamerchant Established commenter

    I agree, it is worse. There is an air of entitlement that I did not experience when I was growing up.
    It is the teachers fault that a student who cannot read does not get 5 A* to Cs
    Students\'s observe teachers so believe that they have equal experience and knowledge as the adults that teach them
    Young children think it is ok to squirt adults with water pistols, swear at them attack them and this is just in the classroom.
    Very few people say excuse me anymore, for get saying sorry
    Private conversations about intimate issues on public transport
    I have no truck with anyone who tells me it was worse twenty in the past.
    Fewer sexual assaults
    Whilst the world is not decaying, it has indeed declined in some instances.
     
    JosieWhitehead likes this.
  19. delmamerchant

    delmamerchant Established commenter


    You make a good point but no, it is definitely worse in some instances. My daughter who is 30 also thinks so.
     
  20. delmamerchant

    delmamerchant Established commenter

    I try to concentrate on the nice ones but the horrible little ******* of life seem to look for trouble. I always try to find the good in any situation and do good deeds where I can.
     

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