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Applying for a job where you have done a day's supply!! Agency claim?

Discussion in 'Supply teaching' started by robyn147, Apr 30, 2012.

  1. So I've seen a job in a school where I have done ..... a day's supply. School seems ok, although they seem very very hot on APP but there you go.
    I am interested in applying - is there anyway the agency (were they to find out) could claim a finder's fee?
    At what point could the agency put in a claim? I've also seen another job in a school which I get rebooked for regularly. It's a properly advertised position. Could the agency claim they introduced me?

  2. Moony

    Moony Lead commenter

    If you've seen the add on the TES you should be fine. It's if they've sent you as a candidate that they'ed have to pay a finders fee. At least thats my understanding of it.
  3. This is wrong.
    The agency will be able to claim a finders fee off the school unless there has been a 14 week gap since you first worked at the school or an 8 week gap since you last worked at the school (whichever of these two methods provide the longest tie-in period)
  4. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    If this is the small print in the OP[s contract with the agency, and the job has a September start, the OP could apply and refuse any further supply bookings with the school from that agency. Assuming that it is a few weeks since the OP did that one supply day at the school, there will be a 14 week gap in their placements at the school by September if they are the successful candidate.
  5. Anonymous

    Anonymous New commenter

    It's a bit cheeky if they do - a day supply surely does not merit a large finder's fee. Maybe a couple of quid. It's a bit hard if you do lots of supply in your local area and the agency expects a cut.

  6. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    It doesn't matter how many bookings you had at a school, if the agency introduced you and the school take you on via a contract within a set period, the agreement between agency and school menas that a hefty finder's fee witll be charged. I'm talking several thousand pounds. Basically the agency want compensation for the profit they would otherwise have made from your supply bookings.
  7. Anonymous

    Anonymous New commenter

    I don't see how the agency can claim compensation - it's not like they are losing out (if I got the job). Currently I go to a school and do supply if a teacher is sick or is on a course. I have no doubt that if I could not do that day supply, the agency would find someone else on their books to do it. I can see that if I were on a contract with a school through a supply agency (say a term contract) and then that job got converted to a school contract - I can see the agency would be losing out - but I don't see how they can claim to be losing out if one of their day to day supplies gets a job at a school where they do some work occasionally.
    The agency will still have plenty of supply bookings at that school and will still make lots of money.
  8. Anonymous

    Anonymous New commenter

    That's the key - define introduction.
    Does a one off booking count?

  9. if the agency introduced you
    That's the key - define introduction.
    Does a one off booking count?
    According to the paperwork with my agencies it does.... It does feel like bonded slavery tho. Cf my position where I wrote to the school with my CV three times for work and they employment me through an agency as they are disorganised and lost my CV - arguably I introduced myself. Agency wants £4k intro fee = employed through agency.
  10. I don't see how agencies can justify finders fees when there's so little supply work with lots of teachers available to do the little there is.

    Agency finders fee has worked against me. I did a 2 term maternity cover on long term supply after teaching on daily supply at the school but, because I didn't have a temporary contract (and haven't been able to get a contracted post since), I haven't been able to go up the pay scale. This should work in my favour when I'm applying for jobs as I'm more experienced than a NQT but almost as cheap. It doesn't though as I'm sure that when the shortlisting panel see when I qualified (coupled with my age) and see that I've only done supply, then my application goes straight in the bin. It should work in my favour that the school wanted me to work there after seeing my teaching over several days/weeks rather than just a 10/20 minute interview lesson but it doesn't.
  11. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    Those who choose to work on supply, or have no alternative, should prioritise registration with the LA supply service if they still have one.
    If they have outsourced the provision, ask the LA which private agency is their nominated one. That at least means being paid to scale: sometimes the nominated agency is the employer but in other LAs the LA continue to pay the teacher (as in LANCASHIRE FOR INSTANCE).
    Service with a nominated agency usually counts for pay progression on the Teachers'Payscale.
    The other way to get around the private agency stranglehold is to circulate your CV to schools, even turning up to deliver it and asking to see the person in charge of temporary recruitment at the school. Attach a passport style photograph to the CV so that they will remember you when they are next looking for someone in your specialism.
    I once managed about 18 months of employment in a 3 yr period at a school from sending them my CV,all at LA rates.
  12. Jubilee is quite right - a hefty fee.
    I once did long term supply in an independent school via Hays and was told that the "finders fee" for me would be roughly £4,500!!!!!
    That is a lot of dosh. There is no way a school would fork out that - even if you were brilliant when there are other brilliant candidates without that price tag around their necks!
  13. The school I am at forked out £7k for a perm MFL teacher in January who lasted until February. The school is not bad, but is in an area some people would consider remote and recruitment can be tricky. We have a fair amount of overseas teachers etc. This was just before I started so of course the school was anti finders fees, but have agreed to AWR until July. The new supply teacher in MFL doesn't even have a staff badge! At least I got that and login in day one although intially only booked for three weeks. Ironically it is possible I will have a 0.5 next year... but I guess an agency fee for a one year p/t contract will be less. It also looks like the private school where I have taught for three years after intially saying they had nothing for me will have a 0.1 - and with PhD stuff that will be more than enough for me... Fingers crossed it all comes off.
  14. Pennyforyourthoughts

    Pennyforyourthoughts Occasional commenter

    Its time finders fees were challenged. When I found that I had to seek work through Agencies rather than rely on direct any more I told the Agency that I was already known to certain schools and gave them a list, this covered me should they try to get a finders fee should they wish to re engage me direct at any time whilst working for an Agency. I happen to have worked or been on placement at most of the schools in my area so there was few left for them to try it on should I get work with them direct. SO I SUGGEST EVERYONE......... MAKE A LIST OF ALMOST ALL THE SCHOOLS IN THE AREA AND SAY THEY ALREADY KNOW YOU. AS for applying for jobs whilst working for an Agency I SUGGEST YOU LET THE AGENCY KNOW THAT YOU WILL BE APPLYING FOR JOBS AT SCHOOLS FROM a LIST you give them. This may exempt them from asking for a finders fee as they already know you will be applying. If you want to avoid a finders fee DO NOT REGISTER to use the Agency as a Permanent Job Finder......... should they ask would you like to be registered for this ..........say no .... say just supply please. If you are not registered with them as actively seeking full time employment whereby they inform you of permanent posts available through them. ......I should imagine they would be hard pushed to get a finders fee. Now should a school wish to keep you on for a contracted period of time and have you released from Agency Employment to LEA employment then .... I believe a 'relinquishing fee' is involved for what they call 'loss of earnings' from the employee. So its not always a finders fee but a loss of earnings fee. Personally I do not think they have either.
  15. jubilee

    jubilee Star commenter

    i'm afraid that would not exempt the agency from charging a finder's fee.
    It's n ot about them putting you forward for a permanent post. They probably wouldn't even have been told about the permanent vacancy if the school were advertising it on TES or in local newspapers. It's about the agency being able to charge a finder's fee if they have placed you on supply for just one day within a certain number of weeks of being taken on by the school directly.
    Schools need to wise up and see that their temporary teachers will be happier and the school will avoid finder's fees and increased rates from agencies because of AWR if they return to the old system of LA registers for supply staff.
  16. jay2603

    jay2603 New commenter

    I am currently working at a school on a long term supply basis and have applied for a full time position at said school starting in September. Do I base the agency fee on 14 weeks from when I first worked there (jan 09 therefore no fee) or 8 weeks from when I last work there ( £4000 fee as I'm booked until the summer)
  17. Eight weeks from when you last worked - the regs work in favour of the agency. The actual fee is calculable by the agency and for a perm position is more likely to be c.£7k.
  18. Anonymous

    Anonymous New commenter

    I can't see an agency trying to charge a school a £4000 fee. That would mean the end of any kind of contract between the agency and the school in terms of future business.
    So - a dilemma. The school may employ you and assume the agency will not try and charge the school or the school will not employ you because they do not want to risk a charge.

  19. I have been on supply on and off since being made redundant 6 years ago.I have given up trying to get a teaching post and recently applied for a TA job at a school I do supply work for(through an agency). I was not even short listed and when I asked the school for feedback was told it was due to th agency contract. Now I know why schools I have been supplying regularly for will not even look at any applications I have made. As I have worked at most of the schoolsu in the area I' m really on a hiding to nothing trying to get a school job at all. They get you every way !
  20. Hi,

    The agency will be able to charge a finders fee approx a % of your agreed annual salary. This is an introduction fee as the agency opened you the door, you have be tried and tested by the school, giving you greater insight upon application and the school have seen the quality before they by. Which is not always the case through normal recruitment channels.

    The person who has commented on the 14 weeks is correct, this will be in the agency terms of engagement which you should have signed upon registration. Most schools are aware of these fees and to be honest if they get the quality of teacher they want, it can be small in comparison to advertising costs.

    Hope this helps, be honest as if the agency find out you risk them charging the school, but this will not hinder your application as good teachers are what schools want.

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