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Am I old fashioned?

Discussion in 'Primary' started by zannar, May 6, 2011.

  1. zannar

    zannar New commenter

    I am known as the strict teacher in my small school because I insist that good manners should be shown at all times. I will not allow children to go to the toilet, get a drink etc unless they say please. I will wait and insist that all children stop and listen before I give instructions. I expect children to say thank you if another pupil holds the door open for them. I will not tolerate children treating my TA as a hired help and not treating them, or any adult, in the school with respect. I will b@ll@ck any child who dares to answer back to any adult in the school. I expect the children in my class to clear up and put things away and clear up after themselves.I have monitors, although I also show that I am willing to help out as it is 'our classroom', not mine or theirs.
    I believe in basic good manners but I feel as though I am swimming against the tide because other staff, and often the HT, will let things go for a quiet life.

    Perhaps I am too old fashioned but, having typed this, I am now even more determined to carry on as I am. I had doubts when I started this but have realised that I really believe good manners and respect are important to me and I will continue swimming!
    No reply needed. I just needed to put my thoughts somewhere.
     
  2. So do I. So do most people here I would wager. Children are children and adults are adults. This is a natural hierarchy that must be respected. If children are not taught this in our schools and homes is it any wonder when they go on to disregard society and the law when they are older.

     
  3. I am exactly the same! Well done everybody :)
     
  4. minnieminx

    minnieminx New commenter

    That drives me mad! Much as I like the children to know they have to behave for me, I dislike other staff suggesting I am somehow wrong. THEY need to demand high standards as well.

    Yeps we must be twins indeed! I had year 5 moving into year 6 last summer and did a similar thing about this time of year to both year 5 classes. However when it came to move up day the class who got me cheered loudly when they found out, so they clearly don't actually mind.

    And it is so lovely to see the shyer children really come out of themselves now they know that no-one is allowed to be nasty to them, mock their answers, be rude to them, mind if they are wrong, etc. And the children who had a reputation for being nasty or badly behaved, are proud to say they have changed.
     
  5. Oh thank goodness, I thought it was only me!!
    One of my collegues and are were only saying last week that it seems that we had gone backwards on that front after the Easter break. Anyone else found this? We had got to a "good" level of manners, etc but it seems to have slipped a bit.
     
  6. I always find standards slip slightly after a long break. The children have a long period of time in an environment where they aren't expected to maintain good manners.
    Mine always have a shock to the system when they come back to school and realise they can't get whatever they want like they do at home.
     
  7. nick909

    nick909 Lead commenter

    One thing that strikes me is that lots of people on here are rightly stating the importance of good manners in school, and as such will demand it in their classrooms and wherever they encounter children around the school (everywhere save the staffroom, then). The fact that some are reporting poor manners around the corridors/in the lunch hall/on the playground indicates a failing at management level then, rather than with the teachers.
    I've noticed standards slipping around my school, and I'm damned sure it's not down to teaching staff, as behaviour and manners in classrooms are good. The way children behave in corridors; the way they speak to TAs (especially upper KS2 children speaking to KS1 TAs); the way they speak to lunchtime supervisors (utterly appallingly) and the way they speak to each other in the playground, are all dreadful. I suspect most on here can relate to all of those.
    SMT, however, are seemingly oblivious to it (we've just awarded ourselves a 1 for behaviour! I nearly fell off my chair!). The response to claims of a lack of manners is to witter about our catchment. I refute this as total nonsense - I've seen as many examples of poor manners in affluent children as I have deprived ones.
    The promotion and enforcing of good manners needs to be a whole school ethos, with a huge degree of refocussing on it as necessary, coming from the top down, and through all channels. Otherwise, it's always destined to be a losing battle

     
  8. I teach children in a very affluent area. Their manners are appalling. They expect everything to just be done for them if they give a demand.
     
  9. lucylollipop

    lucylollipop New commenter

    Spot on, nick909! [​IMG]
     
  10. I agree with most of the other posters..it is all so important...I'm the scary (to the parents!!) YR teacher and I try to start them off well My worst thing at the moment is the number of 5 year olds who say OMG as loud and often as possible..I hate it and where did they learn that?!! Let me think! Also answering Yes! to an innocent question in a tone that is hard to write down but that conveys 'What a stupid question you silly woman!' Stick to your guns everyone..if we don't care then who will?
     
  11. dc521

    dc521 New commenter

    I was once told I had 'too high expectations' for the following things:
    Listening when adults and other children speak
    Lining up sensibly
    Promptly starting work
    Hands up
    Sitting (safely) in chairs
    Getting work completed
    Still, that deputy head is still a drip of a person!
     
  12. Well if you have too high expectations then so do I!
    I remove chairs from children if they can't sit on them properly.
     
  13. minnieminx

    minnieminx New commenter

    Oo that reminds me of a time about 14 years ago (in another lifetime!) when I was doing some secondary supply. I went to a secondary modern school and had been there about a week or so when a child told me to 'f*** **f back to where I came from'. I spoke to the HoY about it and was told "Well what do you expect? We ARE a secondary modern school, you know!"

    Oh well!
     
  14. CarrieV

    CarrieV Senior commenter

    I think the comments regarding lack of SLT interest in manner may be rather generalised, I'm SLT and the expectations I have are only matched by those of the Head! I think manners and courtesy should be a whole school philosophy rather than an individualised one.
     
  15. nick909

    nick909 Lead commenter

    Well, yes, I'm not talking about your school as it would be impossible for me to do so. I've not stated that SMTs are uninterested in manners per se, and I've not referred specifically to you or your expectations at all. I referred to my school specifically, as I'm relatively qualified to speak as such.
    The generalisation that I made was that where poor manners are endemic throughout a school, then that is often a result of a failing of management*. Yes, I completely agree that manners and courtesy should be a whole school philosophy, one that is rigorously applied by everyone, but the responsibility for driving that ultimately lies with the HT and the SMT.


    (*Of course there are external factors that influence this, but these are largely out of our control. Besides, it's still more than possible to create a culture of good manners within a school even where such manners are lacking or non-existant at home)
     
  16. In our school the teaching staff and TAs share a common manners and courtesy philosophy, but it stops short of the head. If a child steps really really out of line we all know better than to send him/her to the top as, sure as eggs is eggs, they'll come out with a 'think' book and/or chocolate.
     
  17. You're not old fashioned at all - you've obviously been brought up correctly. I'm a twenty-two year old trainee teacher in West Yorkshire and didn't have a priveliged upbringing and have worked hard to make people realise that where I was brought up (slap bang in the middle of a council estate) doesn't mean I should now be on the shortlist for the next season of Jeremy Khyle with my 6th baby on the way and no job to speak of.

    What matters to me is that I was brought up correctly by my amazing mum and dad who taught me manners and how to be a respectable person, regardless of my estate and its stereotypes for young girls. I teach at a comprehensive school and expect exactly what you detailed in your post in every single lesson across all of my classes regardless of background, time of day or who they are speaking to.
    I especially go crazy when asked the ever annoying "WHAT?" when I ask something as simple as "Do you have your planner so I can give you a stamp, please?"
    That's not to say that only the kids from the local estates have no manners...a lot of the toffs have absolutely zero manners and on top of that think I am somehow indebted to them and must be at their beck and call.
     
  18. zannar

    zannar New commenter

    I have just read through this thread and I have to say it has cheered me up no end. I am glad I am not alone. It is so easy to think you are alone or battling against the tide when you think of your own school. When you look at the bigger picture things look a bit brighter.
    Thank again.[​IMG]
     
  19. Does anyone else have children asking if they can go 'for a toilet'? It drives me and the class teacher mad!
     
  20. no, my students ask if they CAN go to the bathroom. Ii reply "At your age I certainly hope so, but why exactly are we having this conversation right now?" Half way through they are asking 'May ...". And I teach teenagers.
     

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