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Almost a fifth of Britons don't use the Internet

Discussion in 'Personal' started by Duke of York, Sep 10, 2019.

  1. Duke of York

    Duke of York Star commenter


    It seems that government predictions of how many people use the Internet are based on spurious data. Yet the trend to make government services difficult to access for people without the Internet continues unabated.

    In another of today's news stories, Sainsburys back-tracked on an experiment to have till-free stores. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-49652026 saying the public wasn't ready for this yet.

    "Customers had to scan their groceries using Sainsbury's Pay & Go app, paying for them as they went around the shop.

    But it resulted in long queues at the helpdesk as people attempted to pay for their groceries in the traditional way.

    Sainsbury's said it had learned "a huge amount" from the experiment."

    Had either the government or Sainsburys asked my opinion, gleaned from years of technology and dealing with people, I'd have told them their assumptions were way out.

    We all know that eventually it should be possible to live in an entirely connected world, but in my opinion this stuff is at least thirty years premature. At the best guess by experts, only 80% of the UK population has a smartphone, which would be required for Sainsbury's till-free shops to be useable. The number of people of all ages in my experience, who own smartphones but have been able to use them without encountering some sort of glitch is miniscule.

    Who on earth makes such idiotic assumptions that it's simple to introduce technology in such far reaching ways, without considering how the fifth of our population who can't cope with it yet will become excluded?
  2. Jude Fawley

    Jude Fawley Star commenter

    I'm purposely training myself to forget how to use technology. I've reverted to my non-internet mobile phone and I keep everything very simple re internet use.

    I won't use an 'app' until people use the correct term 'application'. By then I won't use one anyway.

    I'm working towards getting back to just the radio and my own stock of movies.

    I knew what the politicians of the seventies looked like but never took up television and newspapers as my parents had.

    I didn't see any images of politicians until I got the internet in 2007. Jack Straw had aged.

    I knew voices but had never been able to put a face to them.
    T34 and hhhh like this.
  3. TCSC47

    TCSC47 Star commenter

    The people who develop all these modern technology uses have lived with their creations since the beginning and really don't seem to have an appreciation of the waffle barrier that the rest of us mere mortals have to climb to access whatever it is they have built.

    The thing that frustrates me and greatly irritates, is, after struggling to climb over that waffle wall, gaining a great feeling of accomplishment and a really useful tool, they bring out the next version and change the device ever so slightly and this throws us back behind the waffle barrier again. In particular I'm thinking of the Window operating systems and Office Suite. I remember when I first mastered these essential tools, thinking job done. Now to get on and produce some good work.

    Then along comes version 2, 3, 4 and so on.Tomorrow's lessons have to be ready and I'm pulling my hair out trying to find how to change the font or some such trivial thing. Several hours later, small hours of the morning, I finally manage it, but there is still so much to do! It was only a small change and appeared to offer little in the way of better performance, but still has to be sorted! But finally succeeding in getting ourselves up to date we find that the application is still dead easy. That is, until next time they have to bring out another version.
    Bedlam3 likes this.
  4. kimberlyrandall572

    kimberlyrandall572 New commenter

    Agreed..Actually they lack appreciation..Also changing the device too early is bit a sign of maturity..So yeah i also think about the same point
  5. LondonCanary

    LondonCanary Star commenter

    Amazon Go stores continue to open in the US with no cashiers, no cash, and no scanning. Smart phone owners walk in, select products, walk out.
  6. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    For people with fewer than three arms it is very difficult to hold a wire basket in one hand, an item to be scanned in a second hand and a scanning device in a third hand.

    It is one of the reasons why I won't use a personal scanner in Waitrose (plus the fact that a fourth hand is needed for the complimentary cup of coffee).

    It is "scan as you shop" that is at least as much the problem as technological issues. Fixed-position scanners for customer use (as in many branches of Sainsbury as well as Waitrose and others) are VERY much easier to use.
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019
    TCSC47 and Duke of York like this.
  7. Dodros

    Dodros Star commenter

    I still remember the 1980s BBC TV programmes accompanying the introduction of the BBC microcomputer. One of the presenters took pains to argue in favour of us thinking very carefully before adopting every piece of new technology in sight. By way of illustration, he took out his fountain pen and told us how much he still used and valued it for the individuality it gave him in our "brave new world".

    Although I got into computing as long ago as 1983, attending BASIC programming courses, exploring the online Minitel and Bildschirmtext services well before the Internet really took off, deploying ICT in those pioneering days when it enhanced my MFL lessons and speaking about it at MFL teachers' conferences at home and abroad, I have no desire to "graduate to" a smartphone. "Having everything in one place" may appeal to many, but I've also witnessed people who have done so and lost their precious smartphone, surrendering immediately to nightmares about criminals busy emptying their bank accounts using their lost data.

    When I have travelled outside my home town of Newcastle in recent times, I am amazed at the absence of public telephone boxes. There are plenty of them in my vicinity, both in the suburbs where I live and in the town centre and they have come in useful because carrying a mobile is an imposition, an intrusion to me when I go out for a walk or a shopping trip and don't see the point of being in contact with the world and his wife 24/7. I have an answering machine attached to my landline for any urgent messages, which are rare anyway now I'm retired.

    Finally, in the matter of retail outlets, I want to be the master of technology and never its slave. I once went into a Sainsbury's convenience store, chose something from a shelf and went looking for the checkout, only to find that the only ones available were the self-scan variety. Back went my intended purchase onto the shelf before the silly machine had the chance to say "Unknown item in bagging area". I got what I wanted at M & S, which gives me a choice of purchasing method. I positively love my local Aldi because it has no self-checkouts, just superfast human checkout operators who always seem to have enough time for a little verbal exchange. This is why many retirees I see nowadays choose the staff-attended checkouts. It's not because customers like me are clueless about the technology. Too much ICT is deployed nowadays to relieve people from the habit of interacting with others once in a while.
  8. ms honey

    ms honey New commenter

    If the self-service checkouts at supermarkets weren't so useless I'd use them
    Jolly_Roger15 likes this.
  9. blazer

    blazer Star commenter

    Then there is the obsolescence thing. So your computer/smartphone of whatever won't run the latest version of something which then requires doing without or investing yet more money on an upgrade until the next leap puts your device out of date.
  10. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    Some are better than others. Waitrose doesn't bother with the "unknown item in the bagging area" nonsense and there's always a free machine to use so there is no waiting as there is with a staffed checkout. Scanning alcohol is a bit of a nuisance as the machine has to summon an assistant to confirm that I am over 18 (I'm 80, so it is rather obvious that I'm no teenager, but these robots have no common sense).
    ilovesooty likes this.
  11. blazer

    blazer Star commenter

    Don't even get me started on 5G! Who the **** needs to download a movie in half a minute!
    TCSC47 likes this.
  12. Bedlam3

    Bedlam3 Star commenter

    I like the scan and shop thingy. It means I can put stuff straight into my bags in the trolley and then I don't have to take them out again to put on the conveyor belt. It saves time. I always feel nervous though when I get a random check in case Ive forgotten to scan something.
    bombaysapphire likes this.
  13. Andy_91

    Andy_91 New commenter

    So Amazon have re-invented going out to a shop but made it more complicated than using cash?
  14. gainly

    gainly Lead commenter

    For many elderly people living alone, a trip to the supermarket and a chat with the checkout operator might be the only human contact they have all day. I notice at my local Morrison's many older customers chat to the checkout person almost like an old friend. I'm sure the management would like to get rid of all the staffed checkouts which would be very sad.
    Dodros and Duke of York like this.
  15. gainly

    gainly Lead commenter

    On a trip to the USA a few years ago ,the lady at the checkout insisted on seeing ID to prove that I was old enough to buy alcohol. I was 57 at the time.
  16. Duke of York

    Duke of York Star commenter

    I used the most idiotic one yet in Morrisons yesterday. It started by asking if I had brought bags with me and when I confirmed I had, it asked me to put them in the bagging area. Then it threw a wobbly and I had to wait for an assistant to confirm I had only placed my bags there.

    She told me it's best to ignore the thing about bags and pack at the end, so I took the bags off and it threw another wobbly.

    I load the heavy things at the bottom of the bags first so stuff like bread doesn't get crushed. First item in was a pack of beer, so the assistant had to return to confirm my age, and so the nonsense went on.

    How much simpler life was when you could enter a shop and tell the assistant you wanted fork handles, so he fetch them for you.
  17. afterdark

    afterdark Lead commenter

    The governments ploy to make all benefit claimants apply via the internet is very deliberate.

    It is a conscious manifestation of their ideology of tacit hatred towards the poorest and most vulnerable members of society. In the same way that their hostile environment resulted in Windrush. All you Tories are supporters of this hatred, whether you are aware of it or not. Some of you are very far in denial about this. The continual redefining of words and meaning is a part of this. Employed now means working for one hour or more a fortnight.

    If you think that the tories don't hate the poor ask yourseld why is no-one culpable for the deaths of over 80 people in the Grenfell fire? Why? because they were not super rich Tory donors. Voting Tory is your choice, you are choosing hate.
  18. TCSC47

    TCSC47 Star commenter

    Shush Flo! You will give them the idea to use AI and face recognition to opinion that we are over 18!

    Oh Buggger, I just said it! Quick where is the delete button ---- ??? Nowhere when you really need it!
    florian gassmann likes this.
  19. florian gassmann

    florian gassmann Star commenter

    Possibly because the Metropolitan Police have said that their criminal investigation will not be completed before 2021?

    No charges in Grenfell criminal probe before 2021, says Met
  20. gruoch

    gruoch Occasional commenter

    Online banking just got harder. I tried to check my direct debits a couple of days ago and it wouldn't let me without sending a code to my phone.
    This is also now starting to happen with online purchases, but I don't mind that so much.

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