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11% payrise? yes please... oh wait...

Discussion in 'Personal' started by lanokia, Nov 4, 2015.

  1. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter


    Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt has written to 50,000 junior doctors in England outlining plans he says would lead to basic pay increasing by 11%.

    But he wants to curb other elements including guaranteed pay rises.

    The British Medical Association said it had not seen the proposals. It is preparing to send ballot papers out on Thursday ahead of possible industrial action in a fraught pay dispute.

    Mr Hunt says just 1% of NHS junior doctors would lose out under his plans.

    The health secretary's proposed rise to basic pay would see a new doctors' salary rise from £22,636 to £25,500.

    Ah strike action... never works. Oh wait, just the threat of a ballot seems have made the Health Secretary brown his pants. Well it'd never work in teaching... no never.. bow your heads, bow and scrap...

    Of course, we also see that teaching was the testing ground... remove automatic pay progression for doctors, well it's worked so well in teaching... or do you imagine that doesn't have a role in the teacher retention crisis?
  2. Treefayre2

    Treefayre2 Established commenter

    Lanokia - that's the difference between teachers and doctors - one union, and no effective doctors SMT to do the govermnent/OFSTED-equivalent dirty work.

    Very sad stuff. Listening to doctors this morning on LBC lambasting the government and media was both inspiring and depressing, depressing that teachers simply don't have that level of conviction or outlet.
    kibosh, midnight_angel and lanokia like this.
  3. spartacus123

    spartacus123 Occasional commenter

    I suspect a lot of NHS workers, teachers and other public sector workers will look at this offer and think "Interesting.Threaten to go on strike and you get an 11% payrise"
    midnight_angel and lanokia like this.
  4. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    Met up with an old friend in London recently... he's a junior doctor. Told me how sad he was that it looked like there'd be a strike... but that there was going to be a strike.

    Hunt probably can sense this, doesn't want to be the HealthSec who had the first doctor's strike in 40 years.

    Teachers, we need one Union. We must engage our Union. Engage with it and make it do what we want it to do.
    emerald52, kibosh and midnight_angel like this.
  5. Treefayre2

    Treefayre2 Established commenter

    That's the problem.

    All doctors WILL go out on strike as there's one union. In teacher land we have god knows how many unions, alongside many non-unionised academy staff. We also have a female dominated workforce who will mostly cry "But think of the children". The government will laugh, parents will protest. Nothing will happen.
    kibosh and midnight_angel like this.
  6. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    I do love how the concept of a 'strike' is such a novelty for the modern teacher. Such an archaism. You might as well be referring to one of those quaint penny farthing bicycles. The reaction is the same.

    A bit like Lady Bracknell's handbag.

    kibosh likes this.
  7. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    Right now the government is working to limit the right to strike. Even though from my memory teachers have only had two/three strike days [and that was just the NUT so schools remained open] in the last decade.

    Strawman argument put forward to further weaken Unions which are already weak.
  8. Treefayre2

    Treefayre2 Established commenter

    It's a loss cause Lanokia. When I joined the teaching profession in my 30s in 1992 there was still a bit of oomph left in the unions. Every school I worked at (I moved about a lot) had union reps of all unions. Heads had to tread carefully (and in those days it was just a head and a deputy). It all changed under New Labour I'm afraid. The unions were suckered in thinking that NL would be the unions' friends: and we got cover supervisors, EBDs galore in mainstream, the threshold and PM. The rest is history.
  9. Scintillant

    Scintillant Star commenter

    It isn't an 11% payrise as so eloquently explained by the doctor on the Today programme. She drove a bus sideways through Hunt's arguments.
    lanokia likes this.
  10. grumpydogwoman

    grumpydogwoman Star commenter

    You want to listen to us hard nuts @lanokia.

    We go back a bit further than a decade. I brought my guys out in the 80s. Would've been better if the NUT had supported us but.......
  11. VanEyssen

    VanEyssen Established commenter

    Difference is nobody is too bothered if teachers strike and they are probabky unable to do more than a week.
  12. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter


    Aye, I realise... as with all things there'll be caveats and clause that change it.

    But it just caught my eye.
    kibosh likes this.
  13. Treefayre2

    Treefayre2 Established commenter

    A day more like:=)

    "Think of the children!"
  14. oldsomeman

    oldsomeman Star commenter

    In the end it wont be till all teachers go sick or leave that anything will be done...teachers have suffered a pay freeze for a while, pay scales have been dismantled to save the goverment money, Academies have been made to stop local councils interfering and Ofsted is the the governments toy to beat school and in turn teachers with,
    Lets face it...not till the reality of teaching--it pays poorly,is unworkable,its stress ridden with little reward etc ,happens NOTHING will change
    Despite every government saying what a wonderful job they do they never back it up with substance both in wages or in conditions.If the MP's and their minions where treated in the same way there would be no governments...the MP's basically do a job they believe in.like teachers.the difference is they can award them selves massive wage increases on the basis of how hard an MP's life is!
    I still love teaching..but although asked to go back full time i would not do so under the present conditions and regimes i have seen as a supply.
    kibosh likes this.
  15. jacob

    jacob Lead commenter

    We in FE are supposed to be going on strike next Tuesday. Not that any of you "teachers" know this, or care. But the model they used to destroy FE was turned on the teachers about ten years ago, and despite my warnings and those of others, teachers just sat back and have been shafted, just as we were. There has been, and will not be, anything in the media about an FE strike, nobody cares.
    yodaami2, midnight_angel and lanokia like this.
  16. Treefayre2

    Treefayre2 Established commenter

    Jacob is completely correct.

    I remember all your warnings by the way:=)
    yodaami2 likes this.
  17. lanokia

    lanokia Star commenter

    Yeah I remember Jacob's warnings.
    yodaami2 likes this.
  18. smoothnewt

    smoothnewt Star commenter

    Hang on: doctors are highly-trained and save lives, whereas anyone can stand in front of a class these days, and in the public's eye we are glorified childminders. We just don't have the same clout; one union or several unions - it won't make a difference. There's no debate to be had here, sadly.
    midnight_angel likes this.
  19. lizziescat

    lizziescat Star commenter

    I'm not sure I would have included the word 'glorified'

    The paradox of this 'any one can teach' comes down to a conscious or sub-conscious, 'teachers don't really make any difference'. It's the student who does the learning, the family which is the expert etc.
    Except of course when 'it'* isn't working when it's the teachers fault for not making a difference.

    This is the real role of teachers. Child-minding is a secondary role to that of diverting attention from govt/parents/ business/voters inadequacy.

    I've used the word Kafkaesque too many times in recent posts so will abstain from any analogy here.

    *'it' - can be govt policy, an individual child's maths result, failure to win the world cup (although I noticed UK's glorious medal tally at 2012 Olympics was still evidence of failure of state schools) etc

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